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Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby ArturoBandini » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:20 pm

Any Rush fans here? Peart ("Peert") took lyrical inspiration from Ayn Rand, although he has since rolled back his expressed enthusiasm for Rand and calls himself a "bleeding heart libertarian" instead.

Overall I don't let musicians' political statements interfere with my appreciation of their music. If I tried to restrict my music consumption to artists who share my radical political beliefs, I would find myself without much music to listen to at all.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby rabble » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:36 pm

ArturoBandini wrote: If I tried to restrict my music consumption to artists who share my radical political beliefs, I would find myself without much music to listen to at all.

I have disagreed with you more times than I can count but in this case I have to say you're right on the mark with that one.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby drinkinblackcoffee » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:57 pm

Kyle Motor hit it right on the head for me; if I was already a fan it probably would not bother me too much or I could displace it enough to still like an artist. If I never liked them to begin with, it makes me venomously hate them.
Loved Henry Rollins so much, I chalked it up to a bad day when he verbally assaulted a female in the audience at the Barrymore for daring to interact with him on stage. As my love of all things Rolalins wanes, I realize that it was a pretty fucked up thing to do.

Probably the reason I loathe popular music often is because you hear the tabloid bullshit about them know before you ever hear a song. Does Taylor Swift have any real talent? Couldn't tell as I've never heard a song, just gab about who the song is about and pictures of her looking pretty.
Nugent is a hot topic.... Was never a fan, then saw him at summerfest and was blown away by the energy of the set. I chalk his behavior up to what it takes to be that good of a front man.
Michelle Shocked is fucked. That was career suicide after the audio got posted on Gawker simply because she didn't have much of a fan base to begin with, half the people that were into her were probably lezbos since 95% of people probably assumed she was one of them. It was funny how people could argue with her in a normal speaking tone unmiked, must've been playing quite a venue.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby Detritus » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:05 pm

ArturoBandini wrote: If I tried to restrict my music consumption to artists who share my radical political beliefs, I would find myself without much music to listen to at all.

I don't find your political beliefs radical at all. Actually, they strike me as profoundly conservative--almost anarchist in their conservatism.

I was disappointed to learn that Robert Fripp had joined the Gurdjieff people, but I continued to listen to his music. I have also continued to listen to Fela Kuti, who did and said a lot of nasty things to the women around him. But these other folks--Ted Nugent, Michelle Shocked, Phil Collins--I never cared for anyway.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby ArturoBandini » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:11 pm

Detritus wrote:I don't find your political beliefs radical at all. Actually, they strike me as profoundly conservative--almost anarchist in their conservatism.
What would you describe as radical, then?
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby wack wack » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:25 am

ArturoBandini wrote:Any Rush fans here? Peart ("Peert") took lyrical inspiration from Ayn Rand, although he has since rolled back his expressed enthusiasm for Rand and calls himself a "bleeding heart libertarian" instead.


Yes, Neil Peart was an Ayn Rand fan as a 22-year old rock & roll drummer. Then, like other normally developing people, he grew up.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:48 am

wack wack wrote:Yes, Neil Peart was an Ayn Rand fan as a 22-year old rock & roll drummer. Then, like other normally developing people, he grew up.
Heh. I've been a Rush fan since at least middle school, but even as a teenager I knew that a lot of their lyrics -- I'm lookin' at you, "The Trees" -- were totally cheeseball.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby wack wack » Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:28 am

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:
wack wack wrote:Yes, Neil Peart was an Ayn Rand fan as a 22-year old rock & roll drummer. Then, like other normally developing people, he grew up.
Heh. I've been a Rush fan since at least middle school, but even as a teenager I knew that a lot of their lyrics -- I'm lookin' at you, "The Trees" -- were totally cheeseball.


Here's the thing about Neil Peart: I'd bet he knows more about Ayn Rand and whatever you want to consider the anti-Ayn Rand than any politician does. Peart's reading appetite is legendary and the range of his interest is pretty expansive.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby Detritus » Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:34 am

ArturoBandini wrote:
Detritus wrote:I don't find your political beliefs radical at all. Actually, they strike me as profoundly conservative--almost anarchist in their conservatism.
What would you describe as radical, then?

Meh, don't much care. Probably something along the lines of decentralized autarchic Maoism--Pol Pot comes to mind. Certainly not an ideology that simply wants to do away with the regulatory function of government in favor of an sea of unadjudicated contracts. That's a capitalist wet dream, that is.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby kurt_w » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:02 am

I think I used to own a copy of Short Sharp Shocked. Don't think I've listened to it in 20+ years, though.

For another take on this thread's topic, look at the perpetual controversy over playing music of (anti-semite) Richard Wagner in Israel.

I knew generally about this history, but I see from Wikipedia that Theodor Herzl, the founder of Zionism, apparently was able to admire Wagner's music while detesting his anti-semitism.

Of course, that was before the Nazis took over and Wagner's family members began palling around with the Fuhrer:

Image

Image

I guess I mostly don't let the personal beliefs of musicians (or writers, or artists) affect my enjoyment of their work. But I think that's easier when the artist in question is safely dead than when they're still walking around and saying reprehensible stuff. I also guess that if the artist in question were attacking some core part of my personal identity it might be different. I can't fault a holocaust survivor for not wanting to listen to Wagner, and I wouldn't blame a gay person for avoiding the work of a musician or artist who was known for their stridently anti-gay remarks.

This is an interesting thread topic. It raises some tough questions.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:19 am

kurt_w wrote:For another take on this thread's topic, look at the perpetual controversy over playing music of (anti-semite) Richard Wagner in Israel.
Here in America, this most often comes up in relation to Wagner's Bridal Chorus (usually called "Here Comes The Bride") which has become traditionally linked with weddings. Young Jewish ladies raised on Hollywood movies who don't know the history have been known to upset their grandmothers by having this played at weddings.

But if you really want to court controversey, note that the name of the orchestra mentioned in Kurt's link is The Palestine Orchestra. Then ask yourself if a Polish Jew living in what-would-soon-be-called Israel would have named his orchestra that if there existed a non-Jewish ethnic group who identified themselves as "Palestinians".
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby kurt_w » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:34 am

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:But if you really want to court controversey, note that the name of the orchestra mentioned in Kurt's link is The Palestine Orchestra. Then ask yourself if a Polish Jew living in what-would-soon-be-called Israel would have named his orchestra that if there existed a non-Jewish ethnic group who identified themselves as "Palestinians".


I don't think anyone on any side of the Israeli/Arab conflict disputes that the official, Leage-of-Nations-recognized name of the territory in the British Mandate was "Palestine". So I'm not quite getting your point there. The territory was called "Palestine" and the orchestra located there was "The Palestine Orchestra." I think you're struggling to make a point that's not really there.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:46 am

kurt_w wrote:I think you're struggling to make a point that's not really there.
I'm not struggling at all. Either you see the point or you don't care to.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby kurt_w » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:48 am

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:Either you see the point or you don't care to.

Actually, when we write like this it's hard to see anything at all.
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Re: Do personal beliefs of musicians affect your enjoyment?

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:53 am

kurt_w wrote:
Prof. Wagstaff wrote:Either you see the point or you don't care to.

Actually, when we write like this it's hard to see anything at all.
I'm trying to talk softly so the octopuses don't hear us. They're smarter than they taste. And they have very strong opinions about the origins of group names.
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