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Austin "the redistribution" King is finally gone

Please limit discussion in this area to local and state politics.

Postby Stu Levitan » Wed Apr 18, 2007 4:10 pm

pulsewidth modulation wrote: Need I say anymore how biased city channel 12 is? Stu Levitan never brought a guest on that was in favor of AB207... All he said was "the people we invited declined". That's his excuse? That's his attempt at balance? Then he continued to rail on the bill from one angle, and that angle was a loss of "access," which is a totally bogus frame of reference as I have pointed out.


Yeah, when you invite six of the bill sponsors/lobbyists and they all decline, that's a pretty good excuse for having only one side represented. I read from a newspaper article that was very pro-AB207, but could not get a single supportive guest. Sorry. Whine to them. And I didn't rail at all -- I think you're confusing me with Barry Orton and Mary Cardona. And, hey, if you thought the conversation was one-sided -- THAT'S WHY IT'S A CALL-IN SHOW!! We got more calls on this show than on downtown drinking and Halloween combined; too bad you didn't join us.
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Postby JMH » Wed Apr 18, 2007 4:15 pm

If I'm paying Charter money for WYOU, can I make them put Friday Night Fights back on, and without those three stoner fucks who thought they were being funny by talking over the movie? You weren't MST3K, you assholes. You weren't even a theater in Harlem.

Of course, if they do put it back on I guess ol' PM here is gonna scream that they're offering communist propaganda, so...yeah, put it back on, it's funny to listen to him bitch.
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Postby Marvell » Wed Apr 18, 2007 6:58 pm

Do they still show old horror movies on Saturday nights?

Back when I still had a tv and sub-basic cable I'd stumble across some great shit every once in a while - one time they were showing Profundo Rosso, and another time I caught the tail-end of Suspiria.

That was swell.
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Postby Ed Breakfast » Wed Apr 18, 2007 11:53 pm

pulsewidth modulation wrote:Actually, you misquoted me dick head. You're so behind in this debate you need to lie in order to keep up.


Well excuse the fuck out of me, you tricycle riding mop squeezer. I'm sure it's quite obvious to anyone that, based on context (the next two sentences, duh), I meant propaganda. I've tried editing it several times but I get an error. You'll also note that it's not a quote so even if I did mean to type agenda, your earlier comments certainly suggest that you think MCC12 has an agenda, so it would still be correct. In other words, I haven't lied, dolt.

pulsewidth modulation wrote:I also gave an example of PEG supplied propaganda.


I asked for an example of "left wing socialist propaganda" on MCC12. WYOU is indeed a PEG channel but you claimed you saw this on the Madison City Channel. Who lied? Further, I'm not sure the program you cite can be considered "left wing socialist propaganda". Frankly, I don't think it's propaganda, at all.

TheBookPolice wrote:I myself might shout "shitfuckgodDAMN!" in the middle of the Pledge of Allegiance at a sporting event, but that doesn't mean that either speaking or sporting events should be banned because that kind of thing might happen again.


I'm pretty sure it wouldn't constitute propaganda either.

pulsewidth modulation wrote:Those fees are imposed by the Madison City government and cost anyone who subscribes to Charter or a physical phone line MORE MONEY due to left wing intervention.


Actually, those fees were negotiated by the municipality and the cable provider for their use of public rights-of-way. Cable companies typically (always?) pass those costs to the consumer. How is this "left wing intervention"? Does the word "public" mean nothing to you?
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Postby Ed Breakfast » Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:20 am

misterman wrote:So I believe you can judge most politicians based on the answers to these questions-- Did you help limit government action to truly important and crucial areas? Did you help the government act as efficiently and effectively as possible?
I believe King and other "progressive" Danes and Mayor Dave, all failed these standards.


Those are your standards. I respect that, but there would seem to be a whole lot of Madison voters who don't share them. When Austin King last ran for re-election, he won easily. In this last election, progressive incumbents (including the Mayor) were re-elected as well. I'm sorry you don't like it, but many of us want more than basic, bare-bones services. Quality of life and social justice issues are important to us.
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Postby Stu Levitan » Thu Apr 19, 2007 1:07 pm

pulsewidth modulation wrote:Why do I have to remind an ideological progressive that Mad City Broadband is the NEW "access" model? Duh!


Apparently not.
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Postby Chuck_Schick » Thu Apr 19, 2007 1:19 pm

Pulsewidth proven wrong again?

Huh ...

Barry Bonds should hope for such an impressive batting average.
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Postby misterman » Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:30 pm

Ed Breakfast wrote:
misterman wrote:So I believe you can judge most politicians based on the answers to these questions-- Did you help limit government action to truly important and crucial areas? Did you help the government act as efficiently and effectively as possible?
I believe King and other "progressive" Danes and Mayor Dave, all failed these standards.


Those are your standards. I respect that, but there would seem to be a whole lot of Madison voters who don't share them. When Austin King last ran for re-election, he won easily. In this last election, progressive incumbents (including the Mayor) were re-elected as well. I'm sorry you don't like it, but many of us want more than basic, bare-bones services. Quality of life and social justice issues are important to us.


I think we might disagree over what money should be spent on. But I truly doubt that you are opposed to spending tax money efficiently and effectively. I don't think anyone can disagree with that, unless you're trying some FDR, government-led attempt to revive the economy via massive deficit spending.
We could have a debate about what "quality of life and social justice issues" are important, and which ones can and should be addressed by government action. But even these issues aren't well served when government doesn't spend its tax money wisely.

I believe that King, many members of the city council and the Mayor have taken large amounts of tax money and wasted it. Now it's very possible they were pursuing well-intentioned goals. But I don't believe they were very careful or thoughtful about picking the most effective and efficient way to reach those goals.

And that is the difference, for me, between a good lawmaker, and a bad one. Between guys like William Proxmire and Russ Feingold (both principled tightwads), and guys like Ted Kennedy and Ted Stevens (both notorious deficit spenders). Good ones value public money, worry about spending it, and try to make sure that it's actually doing something. Bad ones are careless.

And please, don't let an election tell you who's a good or a bad politician! (I think the current president is 4 for 5--two presidential and two gubernatorial wins, and one congressional loss. I certainly wouldn't regard him as an 80% success.)
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Postby lukpac » Thu Apr 19, 2007 3:13 pm

misterman wrote:But I truly doubt that you are opposed to spending tax money efficiently and effectively.


But who defines "efficiently and effectively"? You?
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Postby bluethedog » Thu Apr 19, 2007 4:21 pm

misterman wrote:I believe that King, many members of the city council and the Mayor have taken large amounts of tax money and wasted it. Now it's very possible they were pursuing well-intentioned goals. But I don't believe they were very careful or thoughtful about picking the most effective and efficient way to reach those goals.

I think the $300,000 streetcar study is an example of this. The air conditioner for the open air pool building is another.

But I'm damn glad the city gave money to "Patty"; not nearly enough in my opinion.
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Postby Mister_A_In_Madison » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:18 am

Stu Levitan wrote:See, some of us think there's a value to the citizenry in being able to watch meetings of the Common Council or city committees, or get a chance to question their political leaders on live TV.

You apparently disagree. So why do you hate democracy so much?


City Channel 12 is free?

I must not have my television's antenna tuned appropriately.
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Postby Mister_A_In_Madison » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:25 am

Grubendol wrote:You imbecile, that's on WYOU cable access and a completely different entity than City Channel 12. And neither are financed by our tax dollars, they're financed by a fee on your cable bill.


The financing is partly from property tax levies (according to City Channel 12's FAQ).
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Postby Stu Levitan » Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:49 am

Mister_A_In_Madison wrote:
Stu Levitan wrote:See, some of us think there's a value to the citizenry in being able to watch meetings of the Common Council or city committees, or get a chance to question their political leaders on live TV.

You apparently disagree. So why do you hate democracy so much?


City Channel 12 is free?

I must not have my television's antenna tuned appropriately.


Ah, where in my post do I say anything about MCC 12 being free?

But I agree -- your antennae are definitely not tuned in right.

BTW -- Austin King will join me for a LIVE exit interview on Access: City Hall this Wednesday, April 25, from 7-8 pm on, yep, you guessed it, Madison City Channel 12. We'd love to have you turn on and tune in (except, of course, those whose head would explode from the contradiction of watching something they don't think should exist). Calls encouraged at 261-9114.
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Postby Mister_A_In_Madison » Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:06 pm

Stu Levitan wrote:
Mister_A_In_Madison wrote:
Stu Levitan wrote:See, some of us think there's a value to the citizenry in being able to watch meetings of the Common Council or city committees, or get a chance to question their political leaders on live TV.

You apparently disagree. So why do you hate democracy so much?


City Channel 12 is free?

I must not have my television's antenna tuned appropriately.


Ah, where in my post do I say anything about MCC 12 being free?

But I agree -- your antennae are definitely not tuned in right.


You have an interesting perspective on what it means to be able to watch, then.

If it is not freely available to everyone, then that is democracy?

But, of course, I should not be surprised since you consider some properties free to be taken by the government.
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Postby ShaneDog » Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:23 pm

misterman wrote:I think we might disagree over what money should be spent on. But I truly doubt that you are opposed to spending tax money efficiently and effectively. I don't think anyone can disagree with that, unless you're trying some FDR, government-led attempt to revive the economy via massive deficit spending.
We could have a debate about what "quality of life and social justice issues" are important, and which ones can and should be addressed by government action. But even these issues aren't well served when government doesn't spend its tax money wisely.

I believe that King, many members of the city council and the Mayor have taken large amounts of tax money and wasted it. Now it's very possible they were pursuing well-intentioned goals. But I don't believe they were very careful or thoughtful about picking the most effective and efficient way to reach those goals.

And that is the difference, for me, between a good lawmaker, and a bad one. Between guys like William Proxmire and Russ Feingold (both principled tightwads), and guys like Ted Kennedy and Ted Stevens (both notorious deficit spenders). Good ones value public money, worry about spending it, and try to make sure that it's actually doing something. Bad ones are careless.

You make a good point. Everyone (well maybe with the exception of companies that benefit from government contracts) wants the government to wisely and efficiently spend our tax dollars. The thing is, the amount of money being spent has nothing to do with how efficiently it is being spent. You can have massive government programs like Medicare, the earned income tax credit, and Social Security that are very efficient, and minor government programs, such as small-scale pork projects that are inefficient. You can also have large scale inefficient programs like the Iraq War and small scale efficient programs too. The amount of money being spent is independent of how efficiently it is being spent.
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