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Streetcar study update

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Streetcar study update

Postby bluethedog » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:06 am

Duh Magazine reports on the latest streetcar study results. Guess what, it's a good thing!

"What we got tonight was good news," said Mayor Dave Cieslewicz. "It underscores the value of a streetcar system for the city. It's a good leverage and a good value for the city."

"The mayor estimates the feasibility study should be wrapped up by the end of the summer. He does not expect the project to go before the city council before next year."

No mention of that pesky referendum he promised - would this even go before the city council at all?

The battle has been joined by the county:

"I think he (mayor) is out of sync with what a majority in the community want and what we can afford," said Falk.
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Postby Bwis53 » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:14 am

Is it true, the Feds are going to pay to build the trolly rail and cars?
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Postby Paco » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:37 am

I'mn still trying to figure out what problem streetcars is going to solve?
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Postby bluethedog » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:41 am

Bwis53 wrote:Is it true, the Feds are going to pay to build the trolly rail and cars?

I don't think so. The Mayor has said he wants to do it without Federal funds. Whichever way it goes, don't forget we're part of "the Feds". It's not "free" money.
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Postby Dulouz » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:50 am

Bwis53 wrote:Is it true, the Feds are going to pay to build the trolly rail and cars?


I was wondering why Falk was so involved in endorsing council candidates such as Eli Judge. I think that she has the votes on the council to throw streetcars overboard in favor of her superior commuter rail concept.
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Postby Michael Patrick » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:58 am

I'm shocked, SHOCKED, that the consultant found hundreds of millions of dollars in benefits directly tied to streetcars.
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Postby bluethedog » Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:58 am

Dulouz wrote:I think that she has the votes on the council to throw streetcars overboard in favor of her superior commuter rail concept.

I'll ask again: doesn't the referendum take the council out of the picture? Does anyone know?
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Postby Bwis53 » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:00 am

Paco wrote:I'mn still trying to figure out what problem streetcars is going to solve?


Get rich, white condo dwellers to give up their cars and ride the trolly. I still hope the homeless ride on it all day, if this gets rammed through.
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Postby Bwis53 » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:03 am

bluethedog wrote:
Bwis53 wrote:Is it true, the Feds are going to pay to build the trolly rail and cars?

I don't think so. The Mayor has said he wants to do it without Federal funds. Whichever way it goes, don't forget we're part of "the Feds". It's not "free" money.


That seems like part of the spin used to make the average citizen think they're not paying for it.

How about if we fix the schools and water first. Then, when that's "fixed" we'll buy trollys...
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Postby Like_Stink » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:13 am

According to someone involved in the study, it was.......well......result-driven. Duh. Why pay for a study if you don't have the answer up front.
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Postby burstingsun » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:20 am

bluethedog wrote:
Dulouz wrote:I think that she has the votes on the council to throw streetcars overboard in favor of her superior commuter rail concept.

I'll ask again: doesn't the referendum take the council out of the picture? Does anyone know?

I think the Council still has to vote to send it to referendum. Unless someone plans to go out and collect tens of thousands of signatures, that is.
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Postby TAsunder » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:36 am

How loud are streetcars going to be? Maybe that's one benefit - me being able to actually hear my music at full volume while walking next to one, which is impossible when next to about a third of the buses in madison.
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Postby Dulouz » Wed Apr 25, 2007 11:10 am

burstingsun wrote:
bluethedog wrote:
Dulouz wrote:I think that she has the votes on the council to throw streetcars overboard in favor of her superior commuter rail concept.

I'll ask again: doesn't the referendum take the council out of the picture? Does anyone know?

I think the Council still has to vote to send it to referendum. Unless someone plans to go out and collect tens of thousands of signatures, that is.


I think that is correct. I also believe that before a referendum, the Council would have to choose the Streetcar plan over the Commuter Rail plan. From my understanding, there will only be one shot at the Federal $$$ and they will likely only fund one of the two projects, not both (of course, that might change with Baldwin's new found influence).

If the Council votes for the County's commuter rail (which would actually give worker's forced to the outskirts a means to commute to Madison jobs), then the Streetcar is dead.
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Postby bluethedog » Wed Apr 25, 2007 11:30 am

Well however it goes down, one thing is clear - Mayor Dave wins. If it passes the Council and the referendum, then he's got his streetcars and he's happy.

If either one of them votes it down, he will have a speech ready on how people just didn't have the vision to go through with it, especially since it's a no-brainer (the study says so).

It's not his fault that $300,000 was wasted on a perfectly good "study" - it's the Council's. Or the taxpayers.
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Postby Brenda Konkel » Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:01 pm

Binding referendum has not passed the council yet.
http://legistar.cityofmadison.com/Detai ... /?key=6552

The notes on the committee discussion are in the legislative history . . .

Also, the streetcar study failed the first time 14:6, VanRooy reconsidered and then it passed 17:2. It took 15 votes to pass because it was a supermajority (15 vote) item.
http://legistar.cityofmadison.com/Detai ... /?key=2152

I'm ashamed to say, I didn't vote against either time because I caved in to the pressure. Voting against were Sanborn, Brandon, Compton, Skidmore, Thomas and VanRooy. The second time around when it passed the two votes against were Sanborn and Thomas - Compton was gone.
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