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Please limit discussion in this area to local and state politics.

Postby Daisy » Tue Sep 18, 2007 5:21 pm

This is fascinating shit to watch from afar. So...Madison has an increasing crime problem, people are getting capped, neighborhoods tagged with gang grafitti, and...someone's upset that the CNA ordinance didn't languish in a COMMITTEE long enough?

Are you fucking KIDDING me? Are they handing out some sort of prize out there whereby you get a lifetime supply of Michael's Custard for being the most politically tone-deaf?
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Postby peripat » Tue Sep 18, 2007 6:21 pm

? So perception trumps reality? If someone fears it, it must be so
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Postby Bwis53 » Tue Sep 18, 2007 7:11 pm

peripat wrote:? So perception trumps reality? If someone fears it, it must be so


It looks to me like perception does trump reality, in today's politics. Just watch today's candidates and their creaky platforms!
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Postby Daisy » Tue Sep 18, 2007 8:01 pm

peripat wrote:? So perception trumps reality? If someone fears it, it must be so
Well, you're 2,000 miles closer to the scene -- I can't address whether people are only "perceiving" gang tags and violent crimes in their neighborhood, with no supporting evidence in the 3-dimensional world.
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Postby AlphaLiberal » Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:45 pm

I like that knee jerk graphic.
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Postby admin » Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:54 pm

Why must citizens always feel they should be involed? Don't they understand that the reason they are sometimes excluded is that the scope of the topic is so far above their heads that if they were let in, it would only waste time as the Government tries to explain to their feeble minds just the basics.

Just face the facts - sometimes the only way to get things done is to let the Government handle it since they have the FULL SCOPE of everything, not just pathetic sound bites from Sly, the mid-day maverick. ( oh please )

Stop trying to butt in and be involved. Get a life and realize that the only role a citizen has is to vote every now and then. Vote, then get the hell out of the way.

- MysticalHamster
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Postby doppel » Wed Sep 19, 2007 11:58 pm

Stu Writes:

So you're suggesting that I should have to choose between honoring my faith and participating in my government? That's what you think the First Amendment means?



Stu, I do not think that the 1st amendment says anything about one's decision to participate in government or when you practice your religion. This was a regularly scheduled meeting, on a business day for the city of Madison. How, why, and who decides that the equal opportunities commmission does not meet on some religious holiday is unknown to me. How many religions can you name? What does the city define a religion as? Yes,I am suggesting that there are sacrifices that people who practice a religion have to make sometimes if they want to participate in a representative government. If the meeting is on Tuesday and I choose to bay at the moon that night instead, its my choice, and the meeting should go on.
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Postby Stu Levitan » Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:03 am

You don't think the First Amendment says anything about participating in government? Last I checked, it protected the right "to petition the government for a redress of grievances." Maybe you've got a different edition.

But, you know, if you can equate your individual, personal decision to bay at the moon on a routine Tuesday with a sacred, time-certain ceremony that millions of people have followed for thousand of years (and millions have died for), well ...
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Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:55 am

Stu Levitan wrote:But, you know, if you can equate your individual, personal decision to bay at the moon on a routine Tuesday with a sacred, time-certain ceremony that millions of people have followed for thousand of years (and millions have died for), well ...

But what about those long established religions who observe the Sabbath on Wednesdays or Thursdays?
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Postby nevermore » Thu Sep 20, 2007 9:04 am

Stu Levitan wrote:But, you know, if you can equate your individual, personal decision to bay at the moon on a routine Tuesday...

Want to leave the Common Council out of this?
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Postby Stu Levitan » Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:40 am

FWIW, as noted on another thread, CDA had an open session Thursday to consider the 38-page RFQ for architectural and other services for Allied Drive development. Number of attendees other than commissioners and staff - zero. Zip. Null set.
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Postby nevermore » Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:36 am

Stu Levitan wrote:FWIW, as noted on another thread, CDA had an open session Thursday to consider the 38-page RFQ for architectural and other services for Allied Drive development. Number of attendees other than commissioners and staff - zero. Zip. Null set.

Your point being...
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Postby Stu Levitan » Fri Sep 21, 2007 8:37 am

My point is that, for all the criticisms people seem to have of the CDA, and all the great interest they purportedly have in Allied Drive, nobody ever comes to our meetings, which is when we actually discuss these matters and take actions. In the overall discussion of the role of commissions in city government, I find that disconnect something worthy of note. People spend a lot of time complaining in chatrooms and on blogs, but when given the opportunity to do something about it ... missing in action.
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Postby nevermore » Fri Sep 21, 2007 8:53 am

But you read the blogs and the posts and the impression I get is that despite this input you (not saying this as a judgement on you or anything) are going to do whatever you're going to do.

Seriously, is showing up to testify at a committee meeting any more real than any of the other forms of communication? I send emails and posts and do blogs and all that - knowing I'm making my point to who I need to make a point to. When it comes time for a council or other committee meeting to happen, especially considering how much of my precious non-work time I spend participating in committee meetings already, I'm only showing up to testify if I'm certain it's going to matter - in other words, almost never.

Do you really think that the public or other committee or council members showing up to testify at your committee is actually doing something about something? Or are we trying to change the subject of this thread and state that it's OK for the council to short-circuit the committee process because some people didn't go another committee meeting?
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Postby Brenda Konkel » Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:38 am

Stu Levitan wrote:My point is that, for all the criticisms people seem to have of the CDA, and all the great interest they purportedly have in Allied Drive, nobody ever comes to our meetings, which is when we actually discuss these matters and take actions. In the overall discussion of the role of commissions in city government, I find that disconnect something worthy of note. People spend a lot of time complaining in chatrooms and on blogs, but when given the opportunity to do something about it ... missing in action.


There was an EOC and Tenant/Landlord Committee meeting at the same time as your meeting. Some people, can't be in three places at once. FWIW - I was in the building, but had three agenda items on another committee agenda.

4:30 PM COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY MAY GO INTO CLOSED SESSION ROOM 260 MMB
4:30 PM LANDLORD AND TENANT ISSUES SUBCOMMITTEE ROOM LL-130 MMB
5:00 PM EQUAL OPPORTUNITIES COMMISSION ROOM LL-120 MMB

And . . . what nevermore said.
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