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Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby Meade » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:23 am

wack wack wrote:I guarantee that I am not the only person who would vote for an actual donkey over Scott Walker. Perhaps many will require an "inspirational" candidate, but many more will not.

Let me guess -- you went door to door collecting signatures for the Walker recall, right? Camped in the rotunda? Chanted "this is what democracy looks like". Took your turns in the drum circle?
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby wack wack » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:32 am

Meade wrote:
wack wack wrote:I guarantee that I am not the only person who would vote for an actual donkey over Scott Walker. Perhaps many will require an "inspirational" candidate, but many more will not.

Let me guess -- you went door to door collecting signatures for the Walker recall, right? Camped in the rotunda? Chanted "this is what democracy looks like". Took your turns in the drum circle?


No. How did you get from there to here? Do you believe that was the entirety of the opposition to Walker?
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby Leroy Gates » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:57 am

wack wack wrote:
Meade wrote:
wack wack wrote:I guarantee that I am not the only person who would vote for an actual donkey over Scott Walker. Perhaps many will require an "inspirational" candidate, but many more will not.

Let me guess -- you went door to door collecting signatures for the Walker recall, right? Camped in the rotunda? Chanted "this is what democracy looks like". Took your turns in the drum circle?


No. How did you get from there to here? Do you believe that was the entirety of the opposition to Walker?


Yeah, Meade looks like you forgot to include the large jackass demographic.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby wack wack » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:02 am

I'd be bitter too, if my first name was "Leroy" and my last name wasn't "Gibbs."
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby jjoyce » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:22 am

Let's address this "Ron Johnson came out of nowhere" nonsense.

That statement is true if your politics are liberal and you live in Dane County. The actual truth is that Wisconsin conservatives were practically begging him to run. He was already an established name on the tea party circuit and, perhaps best of all, had a lot of his own money.

Okay, you might say, the 2011 protests represented something quite similar to the state's tea party movement in that they allowed non-traditional leaders to find their voice on a big stage. And I would agree with you there. But those people have all been listed on this thread: Lori Compas, Mahlon Mitchell, etc.

Is it possible that one of them will emerge in the next year? Do any of them have their own money? Do any of them have a Reince Preibus type helping them strategize? Hate him all you want, but Preibus produced results.

Ron Johnson didn't have Thompson's problems connecting with young, fired up tea party conservatives, and he ran in an off year when the middle isn't as energized to vote. In fact, he was specifically recruited by people who shuddered at the thought of Thompson running against Feingold.

You might recall that Johnson's coming out party was at the same tea party protest here in Madison when Thompson delivered a rambling, almost nonsensical speech that many believed would announce his candidacy but, ultimately, announced nothing. That would have been the spring of 2010, right? Six months before the election?

I guess I think that in order to elect a Democrat as governor in 2014, there first needs to be a wave of liberal emotion that might come close to matching what we saw in 2010. If you want to talk about how that tea party momentum was generated and who paid for it, that's fine. I don't think it matters, because the point is that it happened. Will something similar happen in the opposite direction in the next year? Around what issue? Generated by whom?
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby DCB » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:28 am

jjoyce wrote:Is it possible that one of them will emerge in the next year? Do any of them have their own money? Do any of them have a Reince Preibus type helping them strategize? Hate him all you want, but Preibus produced results.

Also, will any of them attract large sums of money from evil billionaires who see them as useful tools in their global agenda?
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby wack wack » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:33 am

jjoyce wrote:Do any of them have a Reince Preibus type helping them strategize? Hate him all you want, but Preibus produced results.


The great Republican disaster of 2012 rests squarely on his shoulders. And he still believes the Republican message is not the problem.

Are you honestly suggesting that Priebus has been an asset to the Republican party? I hope he's an asset they keep around for a long, long, long time.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby Huckleby » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:59 am

I find JJ's blaming the Democratic failures in WI on candidates and strategists to be way off. The same thing happens on the right where they blame their presidential failures on McCain, Romney, Dole ..... it's the natural emotional response to focus on personalities. Blame the coach!

Look outside of Wisconsin: most of the industrial Great Lakes states vote blue in presidential elections yet are heavily dominated by Republicans at the state level. Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania are part of the same odd, regional phenomena.

Why are Republicans so good at local elections? I think they are a smaller group of more committed voters who show-up at the polls in the lower turnout elections. But that isn't the whole story, there's something in the air in the rust belt.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby pjbogart » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:01 am

How many people in Wausau knew who Tammy Baldwin was a year before she won a State-wide election? A liberal, lesbian lawyer from Madison beat an icon of State political history. In all likelihood, Wisconsin voters rejected Thompson based upon the "revolving door" perception of politics and corporate money. Do you think anyone is clever enough to come up with some instances where Walker signed laws that benefited campaign donors?

Walker didn't win the recall because he's popular. He won the recall because the recall itself was unpopular.

Based upon current trends in politics, the fact that the Teaper movement is all but dead and Wisconsin voters' apparent distaste for cronyism, I'd say that both RoJo and Scooter have an uphill battle to win second terms. The notion that there just isn't anyone out there with the ability to beat these two titans is pure hogwash.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby Huckleby » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:17 am

pjbogart wrote: I'd say that both RoJo and Scooter have an uphill battle to win second terms. The notion that there just isn't anyone out there with the ability to beat these two titans is pure hogwash.


I agree that Walker is vulnerable.

I don't know much about RoJo, mostly unpleasant sound bites. A couple weeks ago he was on "This Week" Sunday show, debating Paul Krugman (among others) on economic issues. Nobody ever wins a debate with Krugman, IMO, but I was blown-away with how effectively and, dare I say it, reasonably that Ron Johnson debated. Maybe I was impressed because I went in with such low expectations.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby doppel » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:36 am

wack wack wrote:The great Republican disaster of 2012 rests squarely on his shoulders.


wack wack is right...in his pick of monikers. Since when is losing to an incumbent President a "disaster"? You could count the times its happened on one hand.

I not sure that PJ is right that Walker and Johnson face an uphill battle.

But if the Democrats field good candidates they could win. Who that would be, I have no names at this time. If they get a lot of outstate money like Tammy did and throw enough mud to cover them over their heads, its possible. Out-state, Walker is vulnerable on schools, his job promises and rejecting Federal money. If they try to attack him mostly on busting the public unions, he'll win again. They also need a good positive message to go along with that. Johnson could get a pass for being a rookie, the mud might not stick as well. Plus he's got his campaign financing in his checking account.
Money and mud win elections today.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby minicat » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:51 am

Huckleby wrote:



A couple weeks ago he was on "This Week" Sunday show, debating Paul Krugman (among others) on economic issues. Nobody ever wins a debate with Krugman, IMO, but I was blown-away with how effectively and, dare I say it, reasonably that Ron Johnson debated. [/quote]

Good lord, what were you smoking at the time?
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby Huckleby » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:02 am

minicat wrote:Good lord, what were you smoking at the time?

Ya, I know, it may have been some sort of mood disorder.

Here is a link:
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/20 ... t-revenue/

I need to find the video so I can recreate the moment in a controlled experiment.
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby Meade » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:03 am

No, you are totally right, Huckleby. Here's the video:
http://abcnews.go.com/watch/this-week/S ... -offensive
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Re: Scott Walker vs. his book and which Dem?

Postby minicat » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:16 am

Huckleby wrote:
minicat wrote:Good lord, what were you smoking at the time?


I need to find the video so I can recreate the moment in a controlled experiment.


might be more fun without the video. but to each his own.
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