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Wind turbines on far west side

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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby snoqueen » Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:37 am

Plans hatched in four weeks? How does one railroad something so immense and that imposing so quickly in Dane County?


The way I understood it, Epic just bought some permits that were already issued to another entity a few years ago.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Mad Howler » Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:07 am

1. We are talking about the turbines to the west when your heading north on 12 before you get to Springfield Corners? This is part of my short cut to north central and I saw them, they were not there a month of so ago on my last trip, and they looked spectacular.

2. Does this have something to do with EPIC? If so that would seem odd on the face of it, but I suppose it's plausible. As much as I salute EPIC's efforts regarding the harvest of the sun's photons and its stirring of the wind, when are they going to be done with that sprawl? Some turbines would be a welcome site rather than the massive cranes that have lingered at that project.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:45 am

Mad Howler wrote:Does this have something to do with EPIC?

Is your reading comprehension really that poor?
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby narcoleptish » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:24 am

Mad Howler wrote: when are they going to be done with that sprawl?


They could have sprawled in a more vertical direction somewhere in Madison. But no.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Comrade » Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:51 am

The biggest problem with them is not the noise.

They are finding that the turbine mechanism is lasting about 30% as long as anticipated, and this is a huge issue.

Wind is variable. It changes all the time. To generate electricity, you need a constant speed. They have a complicated gearbox to vary and adjust the speed from the wind to keep the turbine constant.

Unfortunately, this means that as a source of energy it is only 8% efficient. You get $1.08 return for every dollar spent. You will go broke trying to use this a replacement for fossil fuel.

I took a hard look at this on my farm as I really wanted green engergy to work. It would cost me $60,000 to get one and it would have a life of about 10 years. It could not supply all the electricity that I need. A supplement only, that costs $60K for a decade? No thanks. That is not cost effective.

What I am doing instead is growing corn on my farm to heat my house. I burn shelled corn in a furnce instead of wood or propane for heat. Completely renewable heat that is clean burning and no longer reliant on fossile fuel except for the diesel I need for the tractor to till the soil. This is not perfect but works well when you can grow your own corn. If you had to buy corn and compete with the ethanol producers for the farmers product, you would not come out ahead.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Dairylander » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:01 am

Bravo Comrade.
I have an analogous experience.
I wanted to get an electric car and charge it off of roof mounted solar panels, but the investment was just too much up front. So instead I bought a cheap diesel and am running it off waste vegetable oil I get from local restaurants. The car needs more maintenance than a similar gasoline model, but there are many intangible benefits like Comrade mentioned that make it worth it.
Turbines and photovoltaics will be become exponentially cheaper and more efficient as need and production ramp up.
I hope to one day buy cheap, efficient panels that are made in the USA.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby fennel » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:14 am

Burning corn isn't renewable if you're adding fertilizer, which is most commonly derived from fossil fuels.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Comrade » Sat Dec 01, 2012 3:44 pm

Fennel, Where did I say I was using fossil fuel based manure?

Why are you so dammed negative about someone sincerely trying to use green energy? Is that called for here?

I actually let one of my neighbors spread manure for fertilizer. Come spring, once frost is out of the ground he spreads manure which is a waste product for him and I till it into the ground within 24 hours before the nitrogen can evaporate. I tested the soul and that is all it needs and all I do.

Again why so dmmed negative on your part?
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby snoqueen » Sat Dec 01, 2012 9:37 pm

If a person burns corn raised by ordinary chem-based agriculture, are we releasing into the air residues or combustion products of those pesticides as we burn the corn? I haven't seen any data or info on that question.

I didn't say this was what Comrade was burning, since he (she) didn't say how the corn was raised. I'm asking the question about corn stoves in general.
Last edited by snoqueen on Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Mad Howler » Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:07 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:
Mad Howler wrote:Does this have something to do with EPIC?

Is your reading comprehension really that poor?


Yes I pooched it pretty badly. I have this bad habit of skipping through the middle of threads, this is very disrespectful on my part and in this case caught me in an embarrassing way. Although Comrade, I don't think that the energy capture of coal fired turbines is rediculously efficient. So I think it worth while to promote innovation around the breeze as much as we have with regard to train loads full of coal.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Mad Howler » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:22 am

Still not spinning. From what I have heard, someone failed in planning to plug them into the grid.
Is this true?
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby wallrock » Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:17 am

Mad Howler wrote:Still not spinning. From what I have heard, someone failed in planning to plug them into the grid.
Is this true?

This was my assumption. I noticed a bit of movement in the turbine closest to 12 for a month or two after construction but not since. Even on the windiest of days those blades are motionless.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Jed Starnes » Mon Jun 10, 2013 1:50 pm

I look at these turbines every morning on my commute from rural Sun Prairie to Waunakee. They have not turned at all, in months, even on the windiest of days. They were erected almost overnight. My understanding is that their permitting at the county board level and subsequent construction took place so quickly that it never occurred to anyone that there was not adequate infrastructure in place to support the energy they could potentially generate. Many believe this infrastructure will not be in place for years.

These things have irreversibly changed the landscape of Madison with little or no critique or outcry, yet they've been standing for nearly half-a-year (they had to be completed by December 31, 2012 in order to take advantage of a tax loophole, 'cuz Aunt Judy needed the incentives) and have yet to generate a significant carbon- offsetting watt.

I'm all for alternative energy. Really, I am. I was "green" before anyone knew what "green" was. But I find the silence surrounding these ugly things and the way they've corrupted what was once a really pretty part of Dane County really inexcusable.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Sandi » Fri Jun 28, 2013 10:00 pm

I don't have a problem with green energy, but wind is probably the poorest choice. Not only is it very inefficient, noisy, and an eyesore to the landscape, but a hazard to birds.

I was reminded of this thread today when I saw a bit of irony in this headline.

Rare bird last seen in Britain 22 years ago reappears - only to be killed by wind turbine in front of a horrified crowd of birdwatchers

‘It was really beautiful when it was flying around, graceful and with such speed. To suddenly see it fly into a turbine and fall out the sky was terrible.’

The last sighting of a white-throated needletail was 22 years ago. A relative of the common swift, it is said to be capable of flying at an astonishing 106mph.
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Re: Wind turbines on far west side

Postby Mad Howler » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:31 pm

Rare bird last seen in Britain 22 years ago reappears - only to be killed by wind turbine in front of a horrified crowd of birdwatchers

‘It was really beautiful when it was flying around, graceful and with such speed. To suddenly see it fly into a turbine and fall out the sky was terrible.’

The last sighting of a white-throated needletail was 22 years ago. A relative of the common swift, it is said to be capable of flying at an astonishing 106mph.


Appearently, that 'old' bird didn't get the memo regarding what species is fighting over/running the world.
Nice post, did you cash your check from the Heartland F's yet?
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