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The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

If it's news, but not politics, then it goes here.

Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Mon May 27, 2013 9:42 am

Dangerousman wrote:
Francis Di Domizio wrote:Nothing the media has released is part of the legal case.


You don't think it is relevant and part of the legal case when it comes to getting an impartial jury?


No, the legal case is what you present to the jury. If you think a potential jury is prejudice to your client you have the ability (and duty) to make sure they are not on the final jury.

Dangerousman wrote:Presumably Zimmerman's lawyer believes that Trayvon Martin jumped Zimmerman and put him on the ground, leaving Zimmerman with no reasonable means of escape short of violently defending himself.


Or presumably Zimmerman's lawyer knew he didn't have a shot in hell of using the stand your ground defense when his armed client left his vehicle and pursued the victim after having be specifically advised against that by the 911 operator.

Aren't presumptions fun?
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby rabble » Tue May 28, 2013 10:36 am

We'll have much more to presume, spin, and conjecture in a few weeks.
SANFORD, Fla. – A judge on Tuesday refused to delay the June 10 murder trial of George Zimmerman, charged with second-degree murder in the February 2012 shooting death of Trayvon Martin.

Circuit Judge Debra Nelson, at a hearing on motions ahead of the trial, also ruled that lawyers can't mention Martin's school records, past fighting, marijuana use, ownership of gold teeth, or any photos or text messages found on the teen's phone
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Dangerousman » Thu May 30, 2013 2:09 am

Francis Di Domizio wrote:
Dangerousman wrote:
Francis Di Domizio wrote:Nothing the media has released is part of the legal case.


You don't think it is relevant and part of the legal case when it comes to getting an impartial jury?


No, the legal case is what you present to the jury. If you think a potential jury is prejudice to your client you have the ability (and duty) to make sure they are not on the final jury.

Dangerousman wrote:Presumably Zimmerman's lawyer believes that Trayvon Martin jumped Zimmerman and put him on the ground, leaving Zimmerman with no reasonable means of escape short of violently defending himself.


Or presumably Zimmerman's lawyer knew he didn't have a shot in hell of using the stand your ground defense when his armed client left his vehicle and pursued the victim after having be specifically advised against that by the 911 operator.

Aren't presumptions fun?


You have a pretty narrow view of "legal case" and I doubt you'll find any lawyers who will agree with yours.

You might want to listen to Zimmerman's 911 call again because you're clearly wrong on the facts. There's absolutely nothing in there that suggests Zimmerman "left his vehicle and pursued the victim after having be specifically advised against that by the 911 operator." Instead it indicates that Zimmerman was already out of his vehicle and trying to determine Martin's direction of travel after Martin ran. Only then does the dispatcher ask Zimmerman if he is following him. Zimmerman replied "yeah" and the dispatcher said "OK, we don't need you to do that." To which Zimmerman replies "OK". The remainder of the conversation is Zimmerman talking about where the police can meet him. The call is consistent with Zimmerman heading back to his vehicle to meet with the police.

Your inaccurate portrayal of the facts indicates all the more the importance of getting a good jury, because there's the danger of getting someone who can't follow the facts or pay attention to detail. Someone like you.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Thu May 30, 2013 1:00 pm

Dangerousman wrote:You have a pretty narrow view of "legal case" and I doubt you'll find any lawyers who will agree with yours.


Funny, I made that statment after talking to two criminal defense lawyers who both were surprised that Zimmerman's lawyer got away with releasing that information.

Dangerousman wrote:[You might want to listen to Zimmerman's 911 call again because you're clearly wrong on the facts. There's absolutely nothing in there that suggests Zimmerman "left his vehicle and pursued the victim after having be specifically advised against that by the 911 operator." Instead it indicates that Zimmerman was already out of his vehicle and trying to determine Martin's direction of travel after Martin ran. Only then does the dispatcher ask Zimmerman if he is following him. Zimmerman replied "yeah" and the dispatcher said "OK, we don't need you to do that." To which Zimmerman replies "OK". The remainder of the conversation is Zimmerman talking about where the police can meet him. The call is consistent with Zimmerman heading back to his vehicle to meet with the police.


Read back through the transcripts (several actually, amazingly all a little different). There is actually nothing in the transcript that indicates that Zimmerman is in or out of his car when asked if he is following Martin, but given that he was out of the car at some point, I'll give you that he was probably already out of the car when the call started (seeing as he is not a police officer that's actually not actually a good thing in my mind, as a neighborhood watch captain he should have known his job is to act as an observer and call the police).

The response of "OK" to the dispatcher's statement "Ok, we don't need you to do that" is non-commital. Had he said, ok, I'll head back to my car, or Ok, I stop then it would actually mean somethng. We have only Zimmerman's word that he then started returning to his car. Given that he's trying to beat a murder charge, his statement has to be taken with a grain of salt. His request that the police call him when they got there rather then meet him at a predetermined location isn't the request of a man going back to his car to wait for the police to arrive.

In other news this story: Zimmerman defense team: Need more cash for proper defense is pretty funny. Knowing a few lawyers who do public defender work, I'm guessing most of them would love to have 10% of what these guys have already spent, available for a case.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby HawkHead » Thu May 30, 2013 1:19 pm

Francis Di Domizio wrote:
In other news this story: Zimmerman defense team: Need more cash for proper defense is pretty funny. Knowing a few lawyers who do public defender work, I'm guessing most of them would love to have 10% of what these guys have already spent, available for a case.


The link states that the lawyers are doing this for free and have spent over $300,000 so far. What are the spending that kind of money on? Professional witnesses, depositions. Seems awful steep when the lawyers are there for nothing.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Detritus » Thu May 30, 2013 1:57 pm

Francis Di Domizio wrote:In other news this story: Zimmerman defense team: Need more cash for proper defense is pretty funny. Knowing a few lawyers who do public defender work, I'm guessing most of them would love to have 10% of what these guys have already spent, available for a case.

Some lawyers only take pro bono cases if they get paid.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Meade » Thu May 30, 2013 4:38 pm

If Obama's FBI had a son, it would look like the falsely portrayed George Zimmerman: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... up/276369/
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby HawkHead » Thu May 30, 2013 4:44 pm

There are so many similarities in that story and the George ZImmerman story. :oops:
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Stebben84 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:00 am

WEST: Let me say, I would like to tell you a little joke. I know how that may sound a bit weird in this context under these circumstances. But I think you’re the perfect audience for it. As long as you don’t — if you don’t like it or don’t think it’s funny or inappropriate that you don’t hold it against Mr. Zimmerman. Hold it against me if you want, but not Mr. Zimmerman. I have your assurance you won’t.
Here’s how it goes: Knock knock. Who’s there? George Zimmerman. George Zimmerman who? All right. Good. You’re on the Jury.
Nothing? That’s funny. After what you folks have been through the last two or three weeks.


http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2013/ ... knock-joe/

What!? That's how you start off a trial involving someone who was killed. Right off the bat, this seems to be a bad sign for Zimmerman.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby HawkHead » Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:27 am

The lawyer also had has opening statement objected to by the other side and sustained by the judge.

Not a great day 1. Hope he picks up speed as the trial goes along for George's sake.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Detritus » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:31 pm

Maybe Zimmerman's lawyer is expecting the jury to convict, so he's already laying the groundwork for a retrial: incompetent counsel for the defendant.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:59 pm

Detritus wrote:Maybe Zimmerman's lawyer is expecting the jury to convict, so he's already laying the groundwork for a retrial: incompetent counsel for the defendant.


No worries, he followed up after the lunch recess by joking about his bad joke.

also there was no signs of Zimmerman's blood found on Martin's hands because the medical examiner never photographed his palms...
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Ninja » Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:40 pm

HawkHead wrote:The lawyer also had has opening statement objected to by the other side and sustained by the judge.


Wow, I hadn't heard about that. Poor form, but I guess if it's sustained...

I'm not real impressed with any of the lawyers in this case so far.
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby johnfajardohenry » Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:08 pm

For those interested, you can watch the courtroom feed live here

http://www.wtsp.com/video/default.aspx? ... 4667563001

Even better, perhaps, is this link. Each evening trial lawyer Andrew Branca posts comments on what happened during the day as well as video of most of the testimony. I think it may be all of it with sidebars, breaks and other instances of the video stopping deleted.

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/06/zi ... witnesses/

I think changeing the 4 to 3 or 2 will get previous days. If not, just go to legalinsurrection.com

I've been listening to it in the background the past couple days. It sounds like the prosecution is trying their best to hose this trial. Their witnesses seem more like they are testifying for the defense, even under direct examination, than for the prosecution.

It is a very interesting process.

John Henry
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