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Klimate Kooks Korrekt

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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Rich Schultz » Mon Mar 12, 2012 8:57 pm

"...vindicating the scientists" blah blah blah
Detritus

" Mr. Gleick requested a leave of absence from the institute after posting his confession online..."
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Detritus » Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:09 pm

Rich Schultz wrote:"...vindicating the scientists" blah blah blah
Detritus

" Mr. Gleick requested a leave of absence from the institute after posting his confession online..."

And therefore global warming is a hoax. Well reasoned, there, "Rich Schultz."
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Rich Schultz » Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:18 pm

Some of the quotes posted in this thread were fake. Since none of you global warming advocates had the integrity to point that out I did it for you. I did not state global warming was a hoax. It's your reasoning that is questionable here "Detritus". This particular scientist is not going to be vindicated. He confessed.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Detritus » Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:25 pm

Rich Schultz wrote:This particular scientist is not going to be vindicated. He confessed.

He confessed that he fabricated quotes? News to me--link, please.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Rich Schultz » Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:48 pm

Didn't say he did. He confessed to fraudulently obtaining documents. Documents that just happened to grow a forgery between the time he obtained them and releasing them. You can pretend he is not the forger if you enjoy fooling yourself.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Detritus » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:03 pm

Rich Schultz wrote:Didn't say he did. He confessed to fraudulently obtaining documents. Documents that just happened to grow a forgery between the time he obtained them and releasing them. You can pretend he is not the forger if you enjoy fooling yourself.

Forgery? I don't see anything in your quoted article that suggests forgery. Where is that part?

You can save time by responding "Didn't say it did" again.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Rich Schultz » Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:21 am

"I don't see anything in your quoted article that suggests forgery."

"McArdle goes on to note that the strategy document erroneously says that the Charles G. Koch Foundation had donated $200,000 toward HI’s climate change goals, when in fact they only donated $25,000, and it was for health care work. Thus, the person who forged the document made a mistake, but one that was sure to prove explosive with climate change advocates. Here was a smoking gun that showed Big Oil (the Koch brothers) was funding climate change disinformation.

Except that wasn’t the case."

"This convoluted whodunnit - dubbed ‘Fakegate’ and charted in detail on the invaluable Watts Up With That? site - started when warmist stooges in the media started smearing AGW sceptics based on an apparent leak of incriminating documents from Heartland. It quickly became apparent that someone had used false pretences to obtain confidential Heartland electronic records, which were posted onto the web along with a purported strategic plan by Heartland to ‘muddy public understanding about climate science and policy’. But this strategic plan was in fact a fabricated document, the suspicion of which arose almost immediately.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/artic ... z1ozhONkaV

The Fakegate Timeline – from soup to nuts
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/02/28/the-fakegate-timeline-from-soup-to-nuts/

"After he was caught, Gleick confessed, but he's still trying the "modified limited hangout": confess to a small crime in the hope that this will mollify investigators and they won't dig up evidence of your big crime. So Gleick has confessed to obtaining the genuine Heartland documents through deceptive means. (He called Heartland posing as a member of the institute's board and talked a gullible junior staffer into sending him the handouts for an upcoming board meeting.) But he still maintains that the fake "confidential strategy memo" was sent to him by an anonymous source, and that he only obtained the Heartland documents in an attempt to verify the memo.

This won't hold up, because Gleick still doesn't understand the meta-data that tripped him up. The fake strategy memo was created about a day before the documents were released, which appears to be well after Gleick pilfered the genuine documents. That fits with McArdle's impression that the fake memo was created by cutting and pasting facts from the other documents. Which implies that Gleick was the forger."
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2012/02/23/fakegate_global_warmists_try_to_hide_their_decline_113225.html
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby DCB » Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:19 pm

Detritus wrote:
Rich Schultz wrote:Didn't say he did. He confessed to fraudulently obtaining documents. Documents that just happened to grow a forgery between the time he obtained them and releasing them. You can pretend he is not the forger if you enjoy fooling yourself.

Forgery? I don't see anything in your quoted article that suggests forgery. Where is that part?

You can save time by responding "Didn't say it did" again.

Gleick has said he made some ethically poor choices. Maybe he did forge something?

But the only ones making that claim are Heartland, whose credibility is pretty shaky. The entire premise of that organization is to put up a smokescreen of bullshit to hide corporate malfeasance.

Does Heartland have any peer-reviewed research showing that CO2 does not produce climate forcings? No? Then they should STFU.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Detritus » Tue Mar 13, 2012 5:23 pm

Let's see if the entire discussion can occur without terms like "warmist stooges in the media" or assuming your conclusion and then providing "evidence" based on pseudo-forensic analysis strikingly similar to efforts to prove Obama's birth certificate a fake. Gleick insists that all the documents were released as he received them; McArdle claims to find inconsistencies with the text of the memo in part on the basis of uncorroborated statements by Heartland on their actual budget. Let's see the real Heartland budget, shall we? Then if it is actually the way they have claimed it to be, we can move on to asking why the memo doesn't agree.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby DCB » Mon Mar 26, 2012 1:22 pm

What are we to make of the recent heat wave? Obviously, extreme temperatures can always occur. But even the occurrence of extremes has a normal variation, and the heat wave we're seeing falls far outside any normal reference point.

"It is remarkable enough to watch longstanding all-time record temps be threatened . . . but the total scope (duration and intensity) of this warm spell is something that has [been] historic and [is] unlikely to be matched in our liftetime,” read an NWS forecast discussion on Tuesday.
...
For the year-to-date, there have been 14,737 warm temperature records set or tied, compared to 1,296 cold records — a ratio of about 11-to-1.

http://www.climatecentral.org/blogs/hea ... territory/

Low temperatures beating previous high temperature records for the date
I've never seen a case where the low temperature for the date beat the previous record high. This happened on at least four occasions during "Summer in March, 2012":

...
Not only did many locations in Canada set records for their all-time warmest March day during "Summer in March, 2012", a number also broke their record for warmest April day
...
Breaking daily temperature records nine consecutive days or more
It is extremely rare for stations with a 50+ year period of record to break a daily high temperature record for seven or more days in a row. The longest such streak of consecutive high temperature records at International Falls, Minnesota, was a 5-day period March 3 - 7, 2000.


http://www.wunderground.com/blog/JeffMa ... 2&month=03

The RealClimate blog has an interesting model:
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/ar ... more-11281
Based on this very simplistic model:
... let’s take the most simple case of a normal distribution that is shifted towards the warm end by a given amount – say one standard deviation. Then, a moderately extreme temperature that is 2 standard deviations above the mean becomes 4.5 times more likely (see graph below). But a seriously extreme temperature, that is 5 standard deviations above the mean, becomes 90 times more likely!
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:59 pm

Scientists have claimed that once the ice over large methane swamps and pockets under the ocean thaw, we're in for serious trouble. Russian scientists recently discovered hundreds of plumes of methane gases bubbling up in parts of the ocean that were previously frozen over. Methane is 10 times more efficient at retaining heat than CO2. So it seems this has accelerated the warming in the Arctic.

It's interesting that anyone who denies warming thinks there is plausible reasoning behind denial. Yes, this has happened before, according to scientists. But it's never happened even remotely this fast ever before, according to the same scientists. And the timeline coincides with increases in coal and other man made CO2 producers.

Or even that they deny the Earth is warming citing specious examples while ignoring the overall. We've lost record amounts of ice in the Arctic (about 30% annual coverage since 1979), where the largest collection of CO2 on Earth is.

The Arctic is also experiencing warmer than normal temperatures while the Antarctic is cooler than normal (the Antarctic has the lowest concentrations of CO2 on Earth). Yet the Antarctic has lost even more ice than the Arctic because of warmer ocean temperatures. Since oceans cover 70% of the planet, and take longer to heat up than ground, this tells anyone with at least one brain cell left that the Earth is warmer overall W/O any temperature readings needed.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:31 pm

Scientists warn of global climate tipping point

It's hot out there. But this time, it's more than idle water cooler talk, according to weather scientists.

At the same time the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's National Climatic Data Center has released a report noting that this spring in the United States has been the warmest since record-keeping began in 1895, a group of scientists has published a paper in the journal Nature warning that the planet is approaching a critical climate tipping point.

Changes to the environment caused by humans, including the burning of fossil fuels and the conversion of nearly 43% of the planet's land to farms or cities, threaten to cause an abrupt and unpredictable shift in the global ecosystem, the scientists said in their paper.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Jul 09, 2012 3:28 pm

I know it's just one data point, but... Past year warmest ever for US
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Ned Flanders » Mon Jul 09, 2012 5:20 pm

Meanwhile, Hank will be jetting off shorty to yet another fabulous world vacation destination.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Korrekt

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Jul 09, 2012 5:34 pm

Driving up nort for a few days later this month with Ms Vilas, stopping at a couple of places to visit friends. Does that count?

Now tell us again why you so adamantly discount human influence on climate change.
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