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The gun thread

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Re: The gun thread

Postby Detritus » Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:17 pm

More Americans have died from domestic gunfire since 1968 (1.4 million, roughly) than have died in all our wars since 1776 (1.2 million, approximately). Mark Shields said that a month ago on PBS, and you know what? He's right.

Perhaps this is why the U.S. has never been invaded. Why bother, when we're doing a better job killing each other all by ourselves?
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Re: The gun thread

Postby pjbogart » Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:52 pm

After reading about the latest shooting in New Mexico, it seems to me that of all the ridiculous stupidity that Wayne LaPierre has inserted into our national conversation about gun rights, he's right in his assertion that the media circuses surrounding mass shootings needs to end. From his perspective, this is probably more about saving face and tamping down any conversation about gun control, but even a broken clock is right twice a day and there may be some merit to changing how the media reports these incidents.

First off, to disturbed individuals, particularly the type of alienated individual who wants to "go out with a bang," the difference between fame and infamy is meaningless. He wants his picture in the paper and on the evening news. He wants people to pour over his diary, study his mental state, talk about his motives. Very often he probably relishes the notion that his family and friends will be shocked by what he's done.

Maybe our focus on the perpetrators is simply encouraging more perpetrators.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby snoqueen » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:49 pm

Could be, but I think the public's right to know and interest in knowing outweighs the possibility of creating copycat perpetrators who want to go out with a bang.

I think curbing glamorous advertising of guns the same way we have curbed glamorous advertising of cigarettes might help some, since we've shown it can reduce smoking (along with stiff taxes). There's sense to how alcohol, tobacco, and firearms are all grouped together in one government agency -- they are marketed similarly.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby DCB » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:48 am

Rick "I'm the biggest dick of them all" Santorum defends your right to kill cops:
GRANHOLM: Why not armor-piercing bullets? Why do you need that?

SANTORUM: Because -- because we're talking about a particular type of bullet that -- that is -- is and can be available to...

GRANHOLM: Deer don't wear armor. Why do you need an armor-piercing bullet?

SANTORUM: But criminals could. And having -- having...

GRANHOLM: And police officers certainly do.


Read more: What Are The Gobshites Saying These Days? - Esquire http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/I ... z2IcoXda4X

As Pierce points out, the Frothy Mix is a total loser even in his own party
And people should listen to you, why, exactly?


And as wack wack points out in another thread,
Recent polls routinely put opposition to NRA policies around 70%.

If we just ignore the crazies and the fanatics, we might be able to have a reasonable discussion about guns.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Dangerousman » Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:33 pm

david cohen wrote:I say release a crime scene photo of one of the victims of Newtown, with their parent's consent. Just like Emmitt Till's open casket photo shocked the nation. American's love their guns but can't handle the reality of the pain their guns are capable of inflicting.


Handling the reality of the pain isn't quite the same thing as being aware of it.

When I teach a concealed carry class I do show photos of gunshot wounds and I tell people that shooting a person in real life is not very similar to what is commonly seen on TV or the movies. It is gruesome and a horrible thing to inflict on another person. I advise them that if they cannot accept the possibility of having to inflict such damage on another human being then they may wish to reconsider carrying a gun for protection. But I remind them that, as horrible as it is to inflict this sort of catastrophic injury on a fellow human being, they need to remember that the other guy be willing to inflict similar damage on you or someone you care about. That may be even a more horrible thing to experience.

I agree there is much sugarcoating in the media. Unlike much of the rest of the world, American news media is hesitant to show the reality of American soldiers returning in coffins, vehicle accidents tearing bodies apart and injuries and death inflicted by criminals, decapitations performed by religious fanatics. They'll show the scars, but not the wounds. The truth is not always pleasant and oddly the media, which ought to be presenters of the truth, "spares" us the truth.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Dangerousman » Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:43 pm

snoqueen wrote:Could be, but I think the public's right to know and interest in knowing outweighs the possibility of creating copycat perpetrators who want to go out with a bang.

I think curbing glamorous advertising of guns the same way we have curbed glamorous advertising of cigarettes might help some, since we've shown it can reduce smoking (along with stiff taxes). There's sense to how alcohol, tobacco, and firearms are all grouped together in one government agency -- they are marketed similarly.


:D The most interesting man in the world. "I don't always shoot people, but when I do I prefer Zwei Glocks."

ATF is actually "ATFE" the "E" stands for explosives. I doubt they're advertised as glamorous. As far as firearms are marketed I think you'll see a wide range of approaches.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Mean Scenester » Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:44 pm

Danny Rose: What'd you do, you divorced him, or got a separation, or what?
Tina Vitale: Nah, some guy shot him in the eyes.
Danny Rose: Really? He's blind?
Tina Vitale: Dead.
Danny Rose: Dead. Of course, 'cause the bullets go right through.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby DCB » Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:57 pm

I can't take any of these any of these "we don't need control because ..." arguments seriously. They're all bullshit.

Walker said too much attention is paid to the weapon in such shootings and cited a recent case as an example: "We just had someone last week in Neenah near a school kill someone with a bow and arrow."
...

Winnebago County Sheriff’s Department Capt. David Mack provided the details, starting with the most important one: "No one got killed. I know because I was there."

In fact there were no serious injuries in the Jan. 3, 2013, domestic dispute in the Town of Clayton, located just west of Neenah.


http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/sta ... ott-walke/
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Re: The gun thread

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:09 pm

"Cars kill more people than guns" ~ NRA.
"slippery shower stalls/hammers/medical malpractice/etal kill more people..."

As soon as the NRA trades in their guns for cars (since they have a greater chance of killing someone), as soon as hunters start arming themselves with Pintos, as soon as mass murderers arm themselves with hammers or scalpels, I'll take them seriously.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby city2countrygal » Thu Jan 31, 2013 9:01 am

pjbogart wrote:Wow, a citadel is a great idea.


Screw the citadel, they should build a panopticon instead.
Then big brother could watch little sister all the time.
(There's some Stripes for ya Neddy)

I know I’m a couple six pages late to the party, but my nickname in high school was beaver, right DB?

Besides, it was discussed on The Daily Show last eve.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Feb 01, 2013 5:17 pm

A TV commercial is being run locally advertising a gun show at the Marriott in Middleton. The ad stresses hunting but I wonder if assault-style firearms, which are inappropriate for any typle of hunting, will be for sale. After all, it might be the last chance to avoid a background check in order to secure one of those people killers.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Ned Flanders » Fri Feb 01, 2013 6:47 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:A TV commercial is being run locally advertising a gun show at the Marriott in Middleton. The ad stresses hunting but I wonder if assault-style firearms, which are inappropriate for any typle of hunting, will be for sale. After all, it might be the last chance to avoid a background check in order to secure one of those people killers.

I've heard that bus loads of gang-bangers are on their way after a quick stop at Culvers.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby DCB » Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:53 am

Another tragedy. If only he had a gun to defend himself.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Mad Howler » Mon Feb 04, 2013 1:16 am

DCB wrote:Another tragedy. If only he had a gun to defend himself.


I think that we have stepped into a deeper level of craziness. I suppose it has been coming, but that does not make our situation less insane.
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Re: The gun thread

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:51 am

DCB wrote:Another tragedy. If only he had a gun to defend himself.

A case of the chickens coming home to roost. If one lives by the sword...
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