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Chadima's hand

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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby Meade » Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:21 pm

jjoyce wrote:As with the Brian Solomon case, I'm amazed that getting hammered in an official setting is more or less sanctioned by the university, which makes situations like this one practically inevitable and invites expensive law suits.


The lawsuit, in this case would be a tort.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby massimo » Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:26 pm

Meade wrote:
jjoyce wrote:As with the Brian Solomon case, I'm amazed that getting hammered in an official setting is more or less sanctioned by the university, which makes situations like this one practically inevitable and invites expensive law suits.

The lawsuit, in this case would be a tort.

Would this tort not reflect badly on the image of the university? (Replying in typical Meade fashion with a question)
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby Meade » Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:41 pm

massimo wrote:(Replying in typical Meade fashion with a question)


Except, typically, my questions are on point. And, in this case, here is my point: It's worth being accurate about which parties are responsibility in a situation where harm has been done. Jason claims that the situation was "sanctioned" by the university. I think he needs to either back that up or else withdraw the claim.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby jman111 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 3:58 pm

Meade wrote:Except, typically, my questions are on point.

Yeah, right. Like these gems from earlier today?
Meade wrote:While laying there in bed, did you worry about how you were ever going to pass freshman English?

Meade wrote:Where will you go? Are there states with a high demand for "lazy greedy union thugs"?

I think you need to withdraw THAT claim.
Last edited by jman111 on Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby massimo » Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:04 pm

Meade wrote:Jason claims that the situation was "sanctioned" by the university. I think he needs to either back that up or else withdraw the claim.

I don't want to speak for Jason, of course, but I agree with him. I agree that university officials "more or less" chose to ignore these parties thrown by Chadima, where people under 21 were being served, thereby "more or less" sanctioning them.

This is not a court of law, there is no beyond-a-doubt burden of proof needed here. This situation reflects poorly on the university, especially in light of how much lip service university administration gives to solving the blight of student alcohol abuse. Tort or no tort.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby O.J. » Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:08 pm

Meade wrote:It's worth being accurate about which parties are responsibility in a situation where harm has been done.


Larry, you ignorant slut. What was that about laying in bed, worrying about passing freshman English?
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby jjoyce » Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:11 pm

Meade wrote:Jason claims that the situation was "sanctioned" by the university. I think he needs to either back that up or else withdraw the claim.


If you're interested in being on point, Meade, which "situation" are you referring to? The alleged assault or the party?
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby jjoyce » Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:05 pm

massimo wrote:I agree that university officials "more or less" chose to ignore these parties thrown by Chadima, where people under 21 were being served, thereby "more or less" sanctioning them.


This is sort of what I'm saying, but not really. First, I'm not really interested in talk about underage drinking here. And I don't even know whether these parties were ignored by Chadima's higher-ups. I'm sure they knew exactly what was happening. Sports reporters who traveled to bowls apparently knew about the parties.

My beef is that having senior officials drinking to excess and approving the purchase of lots of booze on an official trip is insane, criminal assault or not. Like with the Solomon case, I'd like to know that responsible parties are addressing the drinking. Want to get a beer after the council meeting? Fine. Want to have a dozen drinks and get plastered with staff? Not okay.

When you put people in situations like this, where it's a gathering of co-workers and the booze is flowing freely, regrettable situations are almost inevitable, even if they don't rise to this level.

Have you ever heard from a coworker that your company's holiday parties used to really be crazy? There's a really good reason why they're not like that anymore: People do stupid things when they're drunk and grievances are filed, valued employees quit, lawsuits are threatened, etc. Smart HR managers are doing away with that kind of thing and slimmer budgets are just helping them make the decision.

So either the UW is way behind the times or there's so much money and influence from the jockocracy there that they've been able to overrule the risk managers.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby snoqueen » Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:26 pm

Even the band supposedly got cleaned up a couple years ago. Funny how the football program didn't get the message.

You're right about drunken work parties. One place I worked held its festivities at a shooting range for years. It was fun but pretty well out-of-control and got worse as time went on. I think we moved it to Prime Quarter the year after one of the office people got drunk and shot out the lights.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby jman111 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:38 pm

snoqueen wrote:...and shot out the lights.

Was there cowboy kissing, as well?
Damn that Cuervo...
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby Detritus » Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:50 pm

The fundamental problem is that the athletic department operates without meaningful oversight, and has done so for years. Remember that Alvarez basically informed the UW through the press that he was making Bielema his replacement and to hell with state requirements for announcement, search, etc. The Chancellor's response, and that of the Board of Regents, was basically "Oh, OK, thanks for letting us know." Yes, they moved fast on this case. Is this the first case? Is this the only case? Or is this just the most convenient case to make a public show of contrition in order to avoid real accountability?

I say fire 'em all and let the Devil sort it out.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby gargantua » Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:58 pm

Detritus wrote:The fundamental problem is that the athletic department operates without meaningful oversight, and has done so for years. Remember that Alvarez basically informed the UW through the press that he was making Bielema his replacement and to hell with state requirements for announcement, search, etc. The Chancellor's response, and that of the Board of Regents, was basically "Oh, OK, thanks for letting us know." Yes, they moved fast on this case. Is this the first case? Is this the only case? Or is this just the most convenient case to make a public show of contrition in order to avoid real accountability?

I say fire 'em all and let the Devil sort it out.


Based on the case you just made, with respect to lack of meaningful oversight of the Athletic Department, the "fire 'em all" recommendation applies to the Chancellor and Regents for failure to exercise appropriate oversight, right? After all, that is the problem you identified.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby bdog » Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:17 pm

jjoyce wrote:The issue has less to do with Penn State (an entirely different sort of wrongdoing and a completely different level of crime)

I didn't compare the wrongdoing; I compared the UW's typical reaction to this sort of thing with how this one was handled.

They key is (pardon the pun) exposure. Did this guy expose the UW to all sorts of bad press and potential financial liability?

Yup. And so he was swiftly canned. Expect to see this kind of quick response from Universities all over the country when an Athletic Dept. employee engages in this type of behavior.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby Igor » Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:43 pm

snoqueen wrote: If Chadima is gay, and if he were out, this whole scene would have been much less likely. It's the sneaking-around factor and the shame factor that's driving creepy drunken behavior like this.


Not sure I buy that - there are plenty of "out" heterosexuals that are experts at creepy drunken behavior. My guess is that the percentage in the openly gay population is about the same.

Booze just enhances the stupidity that some people have naturally.
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Re: Chadima's hand

Postby city2countrygal » Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:37 pm

Here's a link to the UW report if anyone is interested:
http://www.news.wisc.edu/news/docs/2012_Rose_Bowl_Incident_Review.pdf

Meade: Just don't even use ellipses. You are dangerous with them. Quote someone's whole sentence instead. Please!
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