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Mitt Romney 2012

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby pjbogart » Sun Aug 19, 2012 9:29 pm

I've never heard a person with a background in economics talk about inflation like it was some tangible and readily identifiable object. Inflation is a part of virtually everything we do economically, including paying taxes. Interest rates are affected by inflation so even a simple savings account already has inflation factored in.

It is virtually impossible to determine what portion of your capital gains are simply inflation because there is no single number that represents inflation. It's an educated guess based upon a multitude of consumer goods and services. Oil goes down, corn goes up, beef goes down, rent is up in New York, down in Detroit, water utilities up in Phoenix, down in Des Moines. A huge number of prices are compared to last year, averaged out and a rough inflation figure is produced. It's the ending estimate on the relative purchasing power of your dollars compared to the year before. The inflation rate in July 2012 is 1.4%. That doesn't mean that the inflation rate on your house, corn, oil or Packers memorabilia is 1.4%, it's simply a guide to help you understand whether your money is becoming more or less valuable overall, and how fast the change is occurring.

So you say, "I bought $150k worth of gold and sold it ten years later for $250k, but I don't think I should have to pay for that portion of my profit which was simply inflation." What does that mean? Why do you consider your profit to have an inflation component that is readily separable? The price of gold went up. It's inflation... which ended up being profit for you. Had you invested in Faceplant you would have lost your shirt.

And your home went up in value due to inflation too. It's not the same inflation as New York, perhaps it's more, perhaps it's less. If the average yearly inflation since 2000 is 2.5% for the overall economy, is that the number you'd like to deduct from your capital gains? Why? Under what rationale is the profit from selling your home any different than your profit from oil stocks? And how is the price of corn (factored by the CPI) relevant to home prices in Tuscon, Arizona? What you're suggesting is completely absurd, mostly because it's unworkable and would add another 10,000 pages to the tax code that you complain is already too burdensome.
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby johnfajardohenry » Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:15 pm

pjbogart wrote:I've never heard a person with a background in economics talk about inflation like it was some tangible and readily identifiable object. Inflation is a part of virtually everything we do economically, including paying taxes. Interest rates are affected by inflation so even a simple savings account already has inflation factored in.

<Snip>

Yes, yes, and yes.

However:

You seem to be saying that the fact that it is hard to measure precisely means we should ignore it.

I disagree.

I have a lot of issues with the way the CPI is calculated but I doubt it could be done much better. For many of the reasons you mention.

But inflation does exist and the CPI is the best way we have so far to measure it. Using it to index gains would require nothing more than a line or 2 in the tax code.

Using it to index tax brackets would also require no more than a line or 2 in the tax code.

The real solution would be to eliminate inflation with sound (non-fiat) money, though that is not foolproof either.

Inflation is not necessary.

In the US we had zero inflation for 130 years, except when Lincoln put us on fiat money during the war between the states. That zero inflation lasted until 1933 when Roosevelt devalued the dollar and took it off the gold standard.

In Europe, prices from about 1200 to about 1914 were remarkably stable. There were 3 inflations but then values would be stable for as long as couple hundred years. The inflations occurred around 1400 (invention of fractional banking, increasing the effective money supply), 1600 (massive influx of gold and silver from South America) and 1800 (industrial revolution and increase in money velocity) Then from 1914 on, pretty constant inflation sometimes high, sometimes low, but always gnawing away at the value of money. In the US it really started in the 1930s.

Inflation is not necessary. But as long as we have it, our tax system should not use it to penalize us.

John Henry
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby ilikebeans » Wed Aug 22, 2012 6:04 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Mitt shows distain for copyright laws.

And now his running mate does the exact same thing:

Twisted Sister frontman Dee Snider has asked Republican vice presidential running mate Paul Ryan's camp not to play his hit song, "We're Not Gonna Take It."

Ryan spokesman Brandon Buck wrote a pithy email in response: "We're Not Gonna Play It anymore."

Snider's statement is a nice chuckle:

I emphatically denounce Paul Ryan’s use of my song “Were Not Gonna Take It” as recorded by my band Twisted Sister. There is almost nothing on which I agree with Paul Ryan, except perhaps the use of the P90X.

Dee Snider
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Stebben84 » Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:01 am

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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby pjbogart » Thu Aug 23, 2012 2:41 pm

Mitt Romney sure has a lot of plans, none of which he can share with us until after the election. I'm not sure if this plays well with Republican voters or if their sheer hatred of Obama is simply so strong that they frankly don't care about Romney's plans. One would think moderate voters are getting suspicious of a campaign filled with vague generalities, even more so than most campaigns.

Can anyone tell me specifically how Mitt Romney proposes to deal with issues like health care costs, unemployment, budget deficits and skyrocketing education costs?

Ryan: Romney has plan to reverse military budget cuts
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby DCB » Thu Aug 23, 2012 2:56 pm

pjbogart wrote:Can anyone tell me specifically how Mitt Romney proposes to deal with issues like health care costs, unemployment, budget deficits and skyrocketing education costs?

I think it has something to do with controlling labor costs via restoring "state's rights". Bringing America back to the good old days, circa 1860.
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Stella_Guru » Thu Aug 23, 2012 3:54 pm

pjbogart wrote:Mitt Romney sure has a lot of plans, none of which he can share with us until after the election. I'm not sure if this plays well with Republican voters or if their sheer hatred of Obama is simply so strong that they frankly don't care about Romney's plans. One would think moderate voters are getting suspicious of a campaign filled with vague generalities, even more so than most campaigns.

Can anyone tell me specifically how Mitt Romney proposes to deal with issues like health care costs, unemployment, budget deficits and skyrocketing education costs?

Romney doesn't really have any plans other than to provide political camouflage for Right leaning Democrats like Obama, by moving even further rightward. Destroying "entitlements" has long been on the Republicans agenda, however for decades there has not existed an environment to actually do so. Political suicide would have been the result. Heavy political doors have been opened the last four years, which have allowed Ryan's rapid rise into stardom. Now it seems anything is possible.
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby DCB » Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:08 pm

I guess I'm not surprised
Romney said after introducing his wife, fellow Michigan native Ann. "No one's ever asked to see my birth certificate. They know that this is the place where we were born and raised."

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/e ... ked-to-see

Just the latest in their race-baiting strategy.
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby snoqueen » Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:11 pm

Was that the same speech where he said this?

"Big business is doing fine in many places," Romney said during a campaign fundraiser Thursday. "They get the loans they need, they can deal with all the regulation. They know how to find ways to get through the tax code, save money by putting various things in the places where there are low tax havens around the world for their businesses."


http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/ ... TE=DEFAULT
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Henry Vilas » Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:48 pm

N.Y. probing equity firms, including Bain

New York's attorney general is investigating tax strategies of some of the nation's largest private equity firms, including Bain Capital, founded by Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney, an official familiar with the probe said Sunday.

Attorney General Eric Schneiderman is examining whether the firms have abused a tax strategy to avoid paying hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes, said the official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the probe. The practice involves converting some fees collected for managing accounts into fund investments, resulting in a lower tax rate.

Some tax experts who spoke to The New York Times, which first reported the investigation Sunday, believed the strategy was potentially illegal, though other experts said it was commonplace and proper.

Of course, Romney would like even more tax breaks.
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:03 am

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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:23 pm

Exit from Bain gave Romney rare tax benefits

Before Mitt Romney retired from Bain Capital, the enormously profitable investment firm he founded, he made sure to lock in his gains, both realized and expected, for years to come.

He did so, in part, the way millions of other Americans do — with the tax benefits of an individual retirement account. But he was able to turbocharge the impact of those advantages and other tax breaks in his severance package from Bain in a way that few but the country’s super-rich can ever hope to do.

As a result, his IRA could be worth as much as $87 million, according to his estimates, and he can continue to earn tax-advantaged income from Bain more than a decade after he formally left the firm.

Yet he wants even more tax breaks for people like himself.
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Stella_Guru » Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:51 am

With Bradley Birkenfeld's (USB Bank whistle-blower and 1st prosecuted by Obama DOJ) release from prison just before the election, do you think we will get to see his list of super-rich American tax dodgers which could include Romney? Or, was Birkenfeld's arrest just to provide legal cover for Obama's predecessor, the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rove criminal cabal, and his potential successor Romney?
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby fennel » Thu Sep 06, 2012 2:11 pm

It looks like the Romney campaign is bailing on MI and PA; cutting their losses in order to focus elsewhere. TPM article
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Re: Mitt Romney 2012

Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Sep 06, 2012 2:23 pm

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