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June Outcomes

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

If you could only have one, which would you make happen?

Governor Walker sent packing
5
63%
Supreme Court lets Obamacare stand (and it gets implemented)
3
38%
 
Total votes : 8

June Outcomes

Postby Huckleby » Fri May 18, 2012 8:50 am

If you had a magic wand and could make only one of the above happen, which would it be?
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby gargantua » Fri May 18, 2012 9:21 am

I voted to send Walker packing. It's a weird exercise in that one has nothing to do with the other, but I imagine you are interested in finding out about relative priorities.

I think Walker is evil, and represents people who literally want to buy up our democracy. As for Obamacare, as it is structured, there is at least a reasonable argument that parts of it may be unconstitutional. And if fully implemented, I'm not sure that it would be that beneficial. To the admittedly limited extent I understand the law, I have some concerns about it. So this was an easy vote for me.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby Huckleby » Fri May 18, 2012 9:35 am

I think the central question our country will face is how dealing with the national debt gets balanced with maintaining a safety net.

Notice that the Simpson-Bowles commission made a lot of painful cuts, raised age of Medicare eligibility, but they left Obmacare standing. Obamacare starts process of cost control, and it would be harsh to raise Medicare eligibility age if insurance companies can continue to deny affordable health insurance to older people. But Simpson-Bowles is not good enough for Republicans, they are on an Ayn Rand crusade.

The Republicans are determined to make good health care access only for those who can pay, and in fact they are skewing access further towards higher income people. They want to make medicare a fixed voucher, and they are trimming-back medicaid - see Walker's capping and trimming BadgerCare. If the Republicans get simple majority in Senate, they will trim-back medicaid through reconciliation.

Walker staying in power will be horribly painful if it happens. And there will be long-term consequences. It's possible that WI will slide into being like Indiana, a mostly reliable red state.

I voted for Obamacare preservation because the effects nationwide are larger. Very painful choice, though. Our country is going to have to face the debt, and Republicans are in a strong position to effectively repeal the New Deal. Obamacare is the bulwark, as I see it.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby Huckleby » Fri May 18, 2012 3:22 pm

I posted this poll in a conservative-leaning forum (I just reworded as Walker winning and Obamacare being stopped.) By 10-1, conservatives see defeating Obamacare as more significant.

In think this result is pretty consistent with past behaviors. Conservatives see the long term significance (they want to rollback New Deal, not expand it) of Obamacare, liberals are lukewarm in their support. I think conservatives see the big picture more clearly, but history will judge.
Last edited by Huckleby on Fri May 18, 2012 3:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby fisticuffs » Fri May 18, 2012 3:27 pm

By 10-1, conservatives see defeating Obamacare as more significant.


Still boggles the mind. It was the conservative approach to health reform. Personal Responsibility. Make those who aren't paying into the system contribute. And Conservatives don't seem to have any problem with their presidential candidate implementing it at the state level. Where are the "repeal RomneyCare" rallies? It's the same damn thing! oh well. I could seriously blow a blood vessel trying to figure out the conservative viewpoints in 2012.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby Huckleby » Fri May 18, 2012 3:32 pm

fisticuffs wrote:Still boggles the mind. It was the conservative approach to health reform. Personal Responsibility. Make those who aren't paying into the system contribute.

They might have supported Obamacare if Romney or Bush proposed it as president. Well, the Supreme Court certainly wouldn't have challenged a health care overall by Republicans.

The Republicans would see ANY health care overall proposed by a Democrat as a government take-over. They already feel burned by Medicare and Medicaid.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby fisticuffs » Fri May 18, 2012 3:43 pm

They already feel burned by Medicare and Medicaid.


They'll feel worse when it's taken away and they all go bankrupt from medical bills. That might be what it takes though to pull some of these heads out of some of these asses.

To answer your poll question I'd agree. Obamacare helps more people. Plus Walker has already been neutered by the previous recalls and can't do near the damage he'd like to. And then there's the John Doe investigation....
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby snoqueen » Fri May 18, 2012 4:12 pm

I could seriously blow a blood vessel trying to figure out the conservative viewpoints in 2012.


It's easy. Anything Obama or any other Democrat does is wrong and bad. That's the prime directive and any inconvenient contradictions it engenders are beside the point.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby Huckleby » Fri May 18, 2012 8:11 pm

I think there is a shot to beat Walker in June.

Obamacare survival looks to be long odds. I say Obama has 50% chance of re-election. The Supreme Court about a 30% chance of leaving Obamacare substantially intact. Very dicey.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby Comrade » Fri May 18, 2012 8:17 pm

[quote="Huckleby"]I posted this poll in a conservative-leaning forum (I just reworded as Walker winning and Obamacare being stopped.) By 10-1, conservatives see defeating Obamacare as more significant.

In think this result is pretty consistent with past behaviors. Conservatives see the long term significance (they want to rollback New Deal, not expand it) of Obamacare, liberals are lukewarm in their support. I think conservatives see the big picture more clearly, but history will judge.[/quot. What conservative leaning forum if you don't mind my asking?
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby WestSideYuppie » Fri May 18, 2012 10:35 pm

fisticuffs wrote:
By 10-1, conservatives see defeating Obamacare as more significant.


Still boggles the mind. It was the conservative approach to health reform.


Still is. But it's not the radical right wing approach.
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Re: June Outcomes

Postby narcoleptish » Sat May 19, 2012 9:01 am

I chose Obamacare. The damage has already been done here, the state is divided and will be for awhile. Barrett is a weak candidate (they all were) and I could wait a couple years for someone better, plus this..

fisticuffs wrote: Walker has already been neutered by the previous recalls and can't do near the damage he'd like to. And then there's the John Doe investigation....


If anything needs to be neutered, it's insurance companies. The only business in the world whose number one objective is to NOT provide the service that you're paying them for. Lawyers will empty your pockets but at least they do the job.

I treat health insurance the same way I treat home insurance, for catastrophe only. I live in fear of pre-existing conditions and won't go to the doctor for little things like a bad knee. And forget about being completely honest with your doctor.

But hey, that's just me. Isn't extremism great?
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