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"Somebody else did that"

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby jonnygothispen » Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:01 pm

What a silly argument for the GOP to pick. OK, NOBODY helped Republicans create a business, no employees who learned English and math in public schools often paid for by property owners w/o kids, no infrastructure to support it...

But it's all they have, and of course another diversion to feed the "socialist" mantra they've developed
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby jonnygothispen » Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:20 pm

Vinnie P wrote: I learned how to work as part of a team long before I was recruited.

America's social system and infrastructure did not build my business.
"...learned" from other people, so somebody else did that for you: they taught you, and you learned. Good point.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby fennel » Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:47 pm

Vinnie P wrote:
fennel wrote:
Vinnie P wrote:No. That isn't true. The President of the United States said it.
You're mistaken, Vinnie. It's well established he did not say that. You may secretly wish he had, but no, he didn't.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j8XhQfvpW8

C'mon, now. Were you this lazy when you started your business? Did you let passers-by spoon-feed you manufactured business advice without evaluating it's legitimacy?
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Vinnie P » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:09 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:What a silly argument for the GOP to pick. OK, NOBODY helped Republicans create a business, no employees who learned English and math in public schools often paid for by property owners w/o kids, no infrastructure to support it...


I am not now, nor have I ever been, a Republican.

I have no employees.

I am one of those property owners without kids who pays for schools.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Vinnie P » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:11 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:
Vinnie P wrote: I learned how to work as part of a team long before I was recruited.

America's social system and infrastructure did not build my business.
"...learned" from other people, so somebody else did that for you: they taught you, and you learned. Good point.


Those people are called my parents and yes they taught me things, but they didn't learn for me, I did that.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Vinnie P » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:14 pm

fennel wrote:C'mon, now. Were you this lazy when you started your business? Did you let passers-by spoon-feed you manufactured business advice without evaluating it's legitimacy?


Are you trying to claim that the video is a fake?

You claimed he didn't say it, the video clearly shows that he did. Spin all you want, but don't lie to me. I don't like liars.

When I started this business I was 14. Most of the advice I got came from Vinnie P. Sr. I didn't learn how to question or second guess him till I was 16, and that was just stupid teenage rebellion. Fortunately I grew out of that silliness.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby WestSideYuppie » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:32 pm

Vinnie P wrote:
jonnygothispen wrote:What a silly argument for the GOP to pick. OK, NOBODY helped Republicans create a business, no employees who learned English and math in public schools often paid for by property owners w/o kids, no infrastructure to support it...


I am not now, nor have I ever been, a Republican.

I have no employees.

I am one of those property owners without kids who pays for schools.


So your case is interesting, but hardly exemplary. A nation of sole proprietorships with zero employees would not be able to rise above bare subsistence.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby fennel » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:47 pm

Vinnie P wrote:
fennel wrote:C'mon, now. Were you this lazy when you started your business? Did you let passers-by spoon-feed you manufactured business advice without evaluating it's legitimacy?


Are you trying to claim that the video is a fake?
Are you trying to claim that the video isn't edited with the intent of decieving viewers?
I have a stunning hunch your dad wouldn't have been so tolerant of your lazy, self-serving thinking.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Vinnie P » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:53 pm

WestSideYuppie wrote:So your case is interesting, but hardly exemplary. A nation of sole proprietorships with zero employees would not be able to rise above bare subsistence.


I agree.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Vinnie P » Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:57 pm

fennel wrote:
Vinnie P wrote:
fennel wrote:C'mon, now. Were you this lazy when you started your business? Did you let passers-by spoon-feed you manufactured business advice without evaluating it's legitimacy?


Are you trying to claim that the video is a fake?
Are you trying to claim that the video isn't edited with the intent of decieving viewers?
I have a stunning hunch your dad wouldn't have been so tolerant of your lazy, self-serving thinking.


Yes. Yeah, the one I linked was just a clip, but I've seen the entire speech.

My dad is a hell of a lot more pissed off about it than I am. So first you lied, now you keep on with the name calling (pretty much more lies). I see a trend.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby pjbogart » Fri Jul 27, 2012 11:06 pm

Vinnie P wrote:Are you trying to claim that the video is a fake?

You claimed he didn't say it, the video clearly shows that he did. Spin all you want, but don't lie to me. I don't like liars.


Drunk post alert!

Right back at ya, chump. Vinnie, no one is saying that your hard work and dedication to success hasn't earned you the rewards and accolades that go with it. What the President said, if you actually watch an unedited video of his statement, is that everyone shares in opportunity because every shares in the responsibility to make that opportunity possible. You didn't build the education system that helped you achieve your success and provided you with customers to purchase your talents, somebody else did that. You didn't build the roads and bridges to make interstate trade inexpensive and efficient, somebody else did that. You didn't create a military that protected your freedom (and access to cheap oil!), somebody else did that.

This notion that every man is an island, a beacon of shining independence, is absurd. If you had been born in Ethiopia, no amount of effort would have made your current success possible. That's not to say that you shouldn't be proud of your success, nor that you should feel guilty reaping the rewards of your efforts, but pretending that you did it all by yourself and that you owe nothing back to the society that made your success possible is offensive. Our grandparents, most of whom are now gone, paid high taxes and built an infrastructure that paved the way for our economy to thrive. Now we sit around clutching our wallets, complaining about socialism and drooling "mine, mine, mine!" We wallow in luxury, as though having the new Iphone or a 3D HDTV is critical to our very survival, yet we refuse to pave the way for future generations to have the same opportunities that we had.

And the problem isn't that the average American isn't contributing enough, it's that a tiny sliver of the population is so consumed by greed that they do everything in their power to increase their already obscene wealth. And they've used right-wing media and the Republican Party to convince you that they're fighting for your interests, but they're not. They're fighting to shed themselves of all responsibility to give back to the society that made their wealth possible. We're talking about people who have billions of dollars in some cases, that's thousands of millions of dollars. Yet they feel no responsibility to give back to the society that made their wealth possible. In their world, sipping $500/bottle scotch at a country club is their birthright, yet teachers are lazy and greedy, a cancer on society.

Why would I fight for them?
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby fennel » Fri Jul 27, 2012 11:22 pm

Vinnie P wrote:Yes. Yeah, the one I linked was just a clip, but I've seen the entire speech.
And what ...? You can't parse English?
And now you're dragging your own unsuspecting father into the mud?
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Vinnie P » Fri Jul 27, 2012 11:55 pm

pjbogart wrote:
Vinnie P wrote:Are you trying to claim that the video is a fake?

You claimed he didn't say it, the video clearly shows that he did. Spin all you want, but don't lie to me. I don't like liars.


Drunk post alert!

Right back at ya, chump. Vinnie, no one is saying that your hard work and dedication to success hasn't earned you the rewards and accolades that go with it. What the President said, if you actually watch an unedited video of his statement, is that everyone shares in opportunity because every shares in the responsibility to make that opportunity possible. You didn't build the education system that helped you achieve your success and provided you with customers to purchase your talents, somebody else did that. You didn't build the roads and bridges to make interstate trade inexpensive and efficient, somebody else did that. You didn't create a military that protected your freedom (and access to cheap oil!), somebody else did that.

This notion that every man is an island, a beacon of shining independence, is absurd. If you had been born in Ethiopia, no amount of effort would have made your current success possible. That's not to say that you shouldn't be proud of your success, nor that you should feel guilty reaping the rewards of your efforts, but pretending that you did it all by yourself and that you owe nothing back to the society that made your success possible is offensive. Our grandparents, most of whom are now gone, paid high taxes and built an infrastructure that paved the way for our economy to thrive. Now we sit around clutching our wallets, complaining about socialism and drooling "mine, mine, mine!" We wallow in luxury, as though having the new Iphone or a 3D HDTV is critical to our very survival, yet we refuse to pave the way for future generations to have the same opportunities that we had.

And the problem isn't that the average American isn't contributing enough, it's that a tiny sliver of the population is so consumed by greed that they do everything in their power to increase their already obscene wealth. And they've used right-wing media and the Republican Party to convince you that they're fighting for your interests, but they're not. They're fighting to shed themselves of all responsibility to give back to the society that made their wealth possible. We're talking about people who have billions of dollars in some cases, that's thousands of millions of dollars. Yet they feel no responsibility to give back to the society that made their wealth possible. In their world, sipping $500/bottle scotch at a country club is their birthright, yet teachers are lazy and greedy, a cancer on society.

Why would I fight for them?


Chump? You see this is ultimately the problem. You start out with "fightin' words" and then you go on to put words in my mouth that were never there, and then spew a bunch of other crap based on false assumptions. Why should I even bother to continue the conversation when you (and some others) refuse to keep it civillized and honest?
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Bludgeon » Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:41 am

wack wack wrote:I invite everyone who thinks they did it all themselves to disavow themselves of any and all police and fire protection.

Invitation accepted. Consider me disavowed.

Vinnie P wrote:Why should I or anyone else "disavow" ourselves of things that we pay for? Do you have some mechanism that would allow me a rebate on the things I don't use? Because if you do, I'll take back all of that police and fire money that I had taken from me right now!


^^ Sign me up too.
Last edited by Bludgeon on Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:46 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: "Somebody else did that"

Postby Bludgeon » Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:43 am

HawkHead wrote:How is a student loan welfare? It's a loan that is paid back.


If you stop pretending its really going to paid back (by the borrower), it's welfare.
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