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If you can't win, twist the rules

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby acereraser » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:45 pm

Or, if you can't win, push through divisive redistricting plans on Martin Luther King Day while an elder state senator and civil rights leader is absent to attend the inauguration. That's how they do it in Virginia. Then they adjourn in honor of Stonewall Jackson, Confederate hero.

Reports of filling his desk drawers with shaving cream have not been substantiated.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby Mad Howler » Mon Jan 21, 2013 11:02 pm

DCB wrote:
Mad Howler wrote:Make what you will of what the JS Corp has to say on this issue.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/sta ... s-statewi/

OK, I will. But really MH, if you think this is important, why not tell us what you think?

Pasch, citing Democratic Party research based on unofficial and preliminary vote data, claimed that "Assembly Democratic candidates actually received 200,000 more votes statewide" despite Republicans winning more than 60 percent of the seats.

The final, certified election results showed a 174,000 edge for Democrats, despite the fact they won only 39 seats.

We think that her statement rates a Mostly True.


Politifact Wisconsin doesn't directly address whether redistricting is responsible for the discrepancy. Seems like that is something that could be measured - compare the outcome to last years districts.

Even Joe Scarborough understands that:
"But I just have to say one other really important point, because I made a mistake over the past month talking about how Republicans have also won a majority in the House. As this article I was referencing mentioned, we actually got a minority of votes nationwide in House races. It was just gerrymandering from 2010 that gave us the majority."


OK, polifuck is kind of going to frame things the way the polif' will. I guess I am naive to look at the popular returns of our state and see that legislative control of the assembly remains in the hand of R's. I guess I am just as naive to look at our nation's result and wonder about a parallel situation. And I suppose that I would be naive to think that this happened by accident.
MH

p.s.- DCB, yah me mind and all that stuff. What the hell else could you think that I am thinking?! This is all a great load of BS, and we better clip it as a collective (sorry Ayn Rand fans).
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby kurt_w » Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:24 am

acereraser wrote:Or, if you can't win, push through divisive redistricting plans on Martin Luther King Day while an elder state senator and civil rights leader is absent to attend the inauguration. That's how they do it in Virginia. Then they adjourn in honor of Stonewall Jackson, Confederate hero.


It's hard to exaggerate how nasty that was. The Virginia senate is split 20D / 20R. One of the Democrats left to attend the inauguration ... and the R's seized the opportunity to ram through a mid-decade redistricting bill to gerrymander themselves another Congressional seat. The "Stonewall Jackson" thing was icing on the cake.

Anybody remember this thread?

South Carolina GOP: whites only

It drove the Forum's little right-winger contingent apoplectic. Well, the kind of obnoxious crap that the Virginia Republican Party just pulled is exactly why the GOP can't get more than about 1% - 2% nonwhite turnout in a state that's 28% black.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby kurt_w » Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:04 am

Traditionally, redistricting is done only every 10 years. I know Texas and Georgia both broke this informal rule with mid-decade redistricting in 2003/2005 (in both cases forced through by the GOP), and I believe the Colorado Republicans tried to do it as well but were blocked by the state courts.

Have any other states done this? As far as I know, this is still rare enough to considered to be "breaking the rules" in most states, but if the Virginia bill gets signed by their governor, I think it's safe to say that the rule is no longer operative.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby Average Joe » Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:03 pm

Bob McDonnell has said he condemns the move by the state senate, let's see if he vetoes the redistricting power grab.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby acereraser » Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:55 pm

Oh yeah, here it is. Mike Papantonio reminded me about this previous episode this morning. In December of 2010, the Attorney General of Virginia stated he felt that the Department of Justice no longer needed to review new redistricting proposals for Virginia (as mandated by the Voting Rights Act of 1965), because Virginia had "outgrown" racism, essentially.

I might agree to stipulate that generally, the flavor of racism in VA is milder today than in 1965. However, the actions of the VA State Senate on Monday clearly show they still need someone looking over their shoulder regarding voting rights.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby bdog » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:18 pm

kurt_w wrote:
Anybody remember this thread?

South Carolina GOP: whites only

It drove the Forum's little right-winger contingent apoplectic.


You were already apoplectic though weren't you?

kurt_w wrote:Ultimately, the path the Republican Party is following will lead to the apartheidization of America.


That Apartheid watch must be up at Def-Con 5 by now.

But I do see your point. I think this will all change by the time Marco Rubio gets the next nomination. Oh hang on, gotta check on that...
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby DCB » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:22 pm

acereraser wrote:
I might agree to stipulate that generally, the flavor of racism in VA is milder today than in 1965. However, the actions of the VA State Senate on Monday clearly show they still need someone looking over their shoulder regarding voting rights.

If by 'milder' you mean "we avoid saying nigger out loud", I guess so.
Sen. Charles W. "Bill" Carrico, R-Grayson, said the change is necessary because Virginia's populous, urbanized areas such as the Washington, D.C., suburbs and Hampton Roads can outvote rural regions such as his, rendering their will irrelevant.

Read more: Virginia Is For Losers, Again - Esquire http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/R ... z2IrLUy6Ce

Well gosh darn it, all those 'urban' people are voting! who let that happen?
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby Detritus » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:25 pm

DCB wrote:Well gosh darn it, all those 'urban' people are voting! who let that happen?

As I remember, a 19th century Republican had something to do with it.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby kurt_w » Sat Jan 26, 2013 9:31 pm

Michigan Rep. Pete Lund is promoting the GOP's plan to rewrite the state's election laws. Here he explains to a reporter why his own party didn't support his plan last year:

It got no traction last year. There were people convinced Romney was going to win and this might take (electoral) votes from him.


How much more cynical can you get? In 2012 the Republicans thought Romney might win Michigan, so they kept its electoral votes winner-take-all. Once Romney lost, they suddenly decided that Michigan's electoral votes really ought to be allocated differently.

But of course, it would be totally wrong for states like, say, Texas or Louisiana or Georgia to re-allocate their electoral votes that way. Oh, goodness, no! It's only in "blue" states that the GOP wants to rewrite how electoral votes are handled.

Parties that have the support of the public don't need to play these kinds of games.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby bdog » Sat Jan 26, 2013 11:05 pm

kurt_w wrote:Parties that have the support of the public don't need to play these kinds of games.

Agreed. It wasn't Republicans that left the State during the 2011 budget battle.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby Mad Howler » Sat Jan 26, 2013 11:52 pm

bdog wrote:
kurt_w wrote:Parties that have the support of the public don't need to play these kinds of games.

Agreed. It wasn't Republicans that left the State during the 2011 budget battle.


Having used the word "battle" would you like to reconsider how you are framing your 'point'?
MH
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby david cohen » Sun Jan 27, 2013 12:23 am

if a political party colludes nationwide to corner the market on electoral votes, is that a violation of RICO laws?
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby Mad Howler » Sun Jan 27, 2013 1:20 am

david cohen wrote:if a political party colludes nationwide to corner the market on electoral votes, is that a violation of RICO laws?


Excellent question, eitherway.
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Re: If you can't win, twist the rules

Postby Bwis53 » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:37 pm

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/0 ... 12922.html

Channel 15 also had a story on it today. I thought it was strange that the story didn't mention names or parties. I tried to find the story on their website unsuccessfully.
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