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Waz up with Woodward?

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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby O.J. » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:01 pm

Sandi wrote:
Let's review: this thread begins with Woodward's revisionist op-ed about "moving the goalposts". When the Whitehouse called him on his bullshit, he tried to change the subject to "they're picking on me".


How can you review when you don't have the facts to begin with?

1) The sequester was Obama's idea as Jay Carney has verified, and it was about cuts only.


The origin of the sequester can be traced to Gramm-Rudman and the debate was reignited by a Republican


At the heart of his reform plan is restoring the process of automatic spending cuts that prevailed in the late 1980s under the name Gramm-Rudman. In the 1980s deficits were the budget cut trigger, but Mr. Kingston would apply it to spending levels. If Appropriators exceed the spending targets set early in the fiscal year under the Budget Act, automatic "sequesters," or across the board program cuts, would be imposed. When this process was in place in the 1980s, the deficit as a share of GDP fell to below 3% from 6%. Mr. Kingston says his goal is to reduce spending over time to 18% of GDP, down from 24% to 25% today.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Stebben84 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:11 pm

Sandi wrote:It would be nice if I didn't have to explain the obvious.


The bottom line, concludes FactCheck.org, is that it doesn’t matter. Both parties are responsible for this puppy, the fact-checking site’s report says, because they both voted for it.

“The reality is that the pending cuts would not be possible had both Democrats and Republicans not supported the legislation that included them,” FactCheck says.


http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2 ... -storyList

"A majority of Republicans did vote for the Budget Control Act that summer, which included the sequester," Woodward wrote in his op-ed, saying Republicans "have had their own episodes of denial and bald-faced message management."


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-575 ... sequester/
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Sandi » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:14 pm

Are you really so ignorant you would try to select something from the 1980s to dangle as the reason for the current sequester?

Amazing! Funny but amazing.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Sandi » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:17 pm

Stebben get a grip please. The Woodward article isn't about who voted for sequester, it is who's idea it was.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby O.J. » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:18 pm

Sandi wrote:Are you really so ignorant you would try to select something from the 1980s to dangle as the reason for the current sequester?

Amazing! Funny but amazing.


Sandi, you ignorant slut, Jack Kingston proposed the sequester in November 2010.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Sandi » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:22 pm

OJ wrote:Sandi, you ignorant slut


Permanant Ignore for cock eater.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby pjbogart » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:26 pm

O.J. wrote:
Sandi wrote:Are you really so ignorant you would try to select something from the 1980s to dangle as the reason for the current sequester?

Amazing! Funny but amazing.


Sandi, you ignorant slut, Jack Kingston proposed the sequester in November 2010.


Nuh-uh. I heard it on Rush and Sean and Vicki that the sequester was all Obama's idea. I mean, they couldn't all be wrong, could they?

This is the conservative media blitz. Instructions for trolls: spam all internet message boards and call-in radio shows with the "fact" that the sequester was all Obama's idea. It's important to get in front of this one so we can create a narrative that firmly blames Obama for any economic downturn related to the sequester. Time is of the essence... get spammin'.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Stebben84 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:26 pm

Sandi wrote:The Woodward article isn't about who voted for sequester, it is who's idea it was.


Except the fact that my quote was from the fucking article.

Also, if republicans thought it was such a bad idea(and mind you, they were part of the negotiations with it) then why did they vote for it.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby pjbogart » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:29 pm

Sandi wrote:
OJ wrote:Sandi, you ignorant slut


Permanant Ignore for cock eater.


For the record, I do not subscribe to the notion that Sandi is a "slut" because I have no information regarding her sexual proclivities. She is, however, a reprehensible, ignorant cunt.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby DCB » Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:05 pm

Sandi wrote:
Let's review: this thread begins with Woodward's revisionist op-ed about "moving the goalposts". When the Whitehouse called him on his bullshit, he tried to change the subject to "they're picking on me".


2) Only after Obama saw the sequester wouldn't be stopped did attempt to add tax reform to it. That is moving the goal post.

It would be nice if I didn't have to explain the obvious.


Ezra Klein wrote:I remember talking to both members of the Obama administration and the Republican leadership in 2011, and everyone was perfectly clear that Democrats were going to pursue tax increases in any sequester replacement, and Republicans were going to oppose tax increases in any sequester replacement.

...
The whole point of the policy was to buy time until someone, somehow, moved the goalposts such that the sequester could be replaced.

The hope was that sometime between the day the sequester was signed into law (Aug. 2, 2011) and the day it was set to go into effect (Jan. 1, 2013), something would…change.

The American people voted for the guy who wants to cut the deficit by increasing taxes.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/02/23/on-the-sequester-the-american-people-moved-the-goalposts/


It might have Obama who suggested the sequester as a "mutually assured destruction" mechanism. It was stupid idea, but then he was trying to negotiate with the sociopaths who had taken over the House, who had threatened to destroy the economy. Obama naively assumed that the Republicans were sincere in their fear of the sequester, that it would lead them to negotiate an alternative.

That was a big mistake. Sociopaths are not sincere, and never negotiate in good faith.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Sandi » Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:10 pm

She is, however, a reprehensible, ignorant cunt.


I didn't know your mother is here too!
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby DCB » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:44 pm

Another characteristic of sociopaths is that they lie with such ease.

Here is Boehner arguing with Boehner about whether or not the sequester will be a bad thing.

This seems the current GOP talking point: its such a tiny amount, its insignificant, and the disaster is all Obama's fault.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Donald » Mon Mar 04, 2013 10:58 pm

I agree with DCB that negotiating with the Republicans is not going to be fruitful. You can't negotiate with people whose purpose is to bring down the economy and to undermine the nation's institutions so they can institute fascism.

The problem is most people don't understand the nature of the modern Republican Party. Indeed Obama doesn't understand the nature of the modern Republican Party. He had better learn, and fast.

Obama will be doing us a service by continuing to engage the Republicans civilly, but never, ever again allowing them to control the debate. He needs to keep going out to the American people with reasonable sounding proposals, and stand against the Republicans efforts to undermine the social safety net. He needs to stay completely out of the inside DC game. It may seem like nothing is getting done, but thwarting fascism will stand as Obama's most significant achievement. And it is a huge achievement.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby Mad Howler » Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:38 am

Donald wrote:You can't negotiate with people whose purpose is to bring down the economy and to undermine the nation's institutions so they can institute fascism.

The problem is most people don't understand the nature of the modern Republican party


Donald, I do not viscerally disagree with this. Could you frame this statement in another way? Clear as your words are, I am not certain the balance of your take will be heard. There are many figurative snipers out there.
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Re: Waz up with Woodward?

Postby DCB » Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:06 am

Mad Howler wrote: Could you frame this statement in another way? Clear as your words are, I am not certain the balance of your take will be heard.

Seriously, MH, you're asking for a foron to be more clear? Wow.

Anyway, I think this piece addresses the issue:
Paul Begala wrote:
Barack Obama is a remarkably gifted politician. But his cardinal political error has been that at times he seems to lack the imagination to even conceptualize how truly nihilistic, irresponsible, partisan, and, yes, crazy his Republican opponents are.
...
Our president, however, is nothing if not smart. And so he has adapted.
...
Fortunately for our nation, the president seems to have hit upon a strategy that works.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2 ... under.html

I'm not as optimistic as Begala, but it does some seem like Obama has given up on the hopeless strategy of trying to reason with the GOP.
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