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97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Huckleby » Sun May 19, 2013 7:27 am

Sandi wrote:A carbon tax has nothing to do with global warming...Nor will a carbon tax make more than a speck of difference in CO2 levels, if any.

This is a confusing premise. Carbon is not nicotine or cocaine, people & business can break the addiction and switch to alternative energy. Gasoline consumption is highly price sensitive. The country could rather easily transition to more natural gas if the price incentives were there, and over long run it would be an economic booster.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Leroy Gates » Sun May 19, 2013 7:44 am

Huckleby wrote:
The AGW deniers have to be defeated, that is step one.


When thermometers are outlawed only outlaws will have thermometers.

You can pry my thermometer from my indeterminate temperature dead hands.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Huckleby » Sun May 19, 2013 7:50 am

Meade wrote:Yes, Koch Brothers has become a huge shibboleth for many on the left and, unfortunately for them, its use by them continually reveals their biases, prejudices, and lack of critical thinking.

If you go to the berkeleyearth.org website, you'll learn it wasn't even the "Koch Brothers" who have given them funding. It's the Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation. But it's easier, I guess, to just say "Koch Brothers" when you're trying to impress and influence potential supporters who don't care much for accurate information.

You'll also learn, by reading their website, that the Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation has given the organization less than 12% of their funding.

http://www.charleskochfoundationfacts.o ... n-support/

Koch Brothers. OH NOES!!!

Are you ashamed of the brothers Koch? I didn't respond to your post initially because I was surprised at your outrage. I heard some conservatives at CPAC speak of the Koch brothers as patriots & heroes. Are you not proud of what ALEC is trying to do to America?

George Soros is regularly pummeled by the right for his support of liberal causes. It wouldn't occur to me to distance myself from him, or point-out that the "George Soros Foundation" is not the same as George Soros.

It was reasonable for you to correct the record and say that last year's AGW blockbuster study was only partially funded by the Kochs. But the continued rant leads me to suspect that the lady doth protest too much. You're welcome over here on Team Soros if the conservative machinery is creeping you out.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby bdog » Sun May 19, 2013 8:06 am

Dedicated to Meade and Huckleby:

Marry him, marry me
I'm the one that loved you baby can't you see?
Ain't got no future or family tree
But I know what a prince and lover ought to be
I know what a prince and lover ought be

Said if you want to call me baby
Just go ahead now
And if you like to tell me maybe
Just go ahead now
And if you wanted to buy me flowers
Just go ahead now
And if you like to talk for hours
Just go ahead now
And if you want to call me baby
Just go ahead now
And if you like to tell me maybe
Just go ahead now
And if you like to buy me flowers
Just go ahead now
And if you like to talk for hours
Just go ahead now
If you want to call me baby
Just go ahead now
And if you like to tell me maybe
Just go ahead now
If you want to buy me flowers
Just go ahead now
And if you like to talk for hours
Just go ahead now
Oh Baby!
Just go ahead now
Oh!
Just just go ahead now
Oh, your majesty!
Just go ahead now
Come on forget the King who... marry me!
Just go ahead now
Come on, come on, come on
Just go ahead now
Go ahead now
Just go ahead now, [etc.]
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Steve Vokers » Sun May 19, 2013 10:19 am

I honestly don't get what the deal is with the Koch brothers and others like them who bitch about how taxes and regulations are strangling business in America. Seems to me that nothing in our current taxing and regulatory regimes prevented them from getting filthy fucking rich.

Yet they want to tilt the scales to shovel even more money to the top? What a bunch of greedy motherfuckers.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Bludgeon » Sun May 19, 2013 10:53 am

Environmentalism: a teleplay.

Hank: "Welcome to Strickland Propane."
Image
Girl: "The banner outside said you're green - what exactly are you doing for the environment?"
Image
Hank: "Well, quite a bit: we have an employee carpool, all our invoices are printed on recycled paper, and as you can tell, the temperature in here is slightly uncomfortable."
Image
Mr. Strickland: "You're burying the lead, Old Top. Tell her about the carbon offsets."
Image
Hank: "I don't think she really wants to hear about..."
Image
Mr. Strickland: "Trees! Beeeautiful trees. I'm planting a forest of majestic oaks, and piiines and whatnot, and those trees are eatin' up all that nasty, nasty carrbonnnn."
Image
Girl: "I respect that: it's the next best thing to us never having had existed."
Image
Mr. Strickland: "It's money outta my pocket, but I'm doin' it for the children - you see, I got a kid, somewhere..."
Image
Girl: "So do I!"
Image
Mr. Strickland: "Well, hah, I find that hard to believe. You take the next customer, Hank. I'm gonna handle this one myself."
Image

Fin.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby rabble » Sun May 19, 2013 4:21 pm

Bob Inglis
Six time South Carolina US Representative until his position on global warming got him defeated in the Tea Party sweep of 2010. He scored high marks from every right wing group including the NRA which gave him an A rating. But he's listening to the evidence on AGW and that got him thrown out. Now he's on a one man crusade to sway the conservatives on this one issue. To find a way to let them admit there's a problem and still save face.

Here's an article of his from last April.

A recent poll from George Mason and Yale finds that only 35 percent of Republicans and Republican-leaning independents agree with the GOP platform on climate change. Now, to be sure, no respondent in that poll could have quoted the platform language on climate change. But it’s not likely that those Republican respondents could have misunderstood us. They’ve heard the GOP pounding climate science and climate scientists, and apparently they disagree with that approach.


Meanwhile, conservatives know from painful experience that we’re losing young people — and not just the free lovin’ types. We’re losing real conservatives students — the kind who take chemistry and physics and economics and who expect their party to be leading to real solutions rather than offering up scapegoats.

In the pain of the Great Recession we sold what turns out to be a bill of goods. We said, “Drill here, drill now, pay less.” Well, we’re not paying less. We’re drilling here and now, and that’s good because if we ever needed to commandeer that supply for national security, we could. But otherwise that oil is being sold on a world market at a world price, and there’s increasing demand for the stuff. In the pain of the Great Recession it seemed reassuring to suggest that we could ensure lower gasoline prices. In the Great Recovery, conservatives need to be the champions of un-subsidized, entrepreneurial innovation. The style needs to move away from comfort oil in the Great Recession and toward creative destruction and innovation in the Great Recovery. That’s good news for conservatives because innovation is our natural style-statement.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby DCB » Sun May 19, 2013 4:33 pm

Bludgeon wrote: In my opinion, whatever we say about CO2, we actually know almost nothing concrete about what the climate was like as recently as 200 years ago.

Who needs to read all those peer-reviewed papers? or evaluate their methods? or try to reproduce the data? Just go with your gut!

Your disdain for reasoned dialogue and scientific analysis is duly noted.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby DCB » Sun May 19, 2013 5:06 pm

Meade wrote:Why pull out and isolate the Koch brothers?

Rabble claimed:
rabble wrote:Any scientist who can come up with a repeatable dependable study or test that even suggests AGW can be denied is guaranteed an unlimited supply of "grant money" for life. There are too many corporations out there who will pay big bucks to keep polluting just a little while longer.


And then Huckleby reminded us of an example of a scientist who was skeptical of AGW, and who indeed did get grant money from noted deniers, including the Koch brothers. Thus proving rabble's initial point - that corporate deniers are ready, willing and able to throw money at anyone who will support their position.

Real scientists, of course, welcome such scrutiny. Science advances when accepted theories are challenged.

As it turns out, even a skeptical scientist getting corporate funding came up with the same conclusion as the overwhelming majority of his peers: AGW is real.

The corporate deniers are unable to find any scientific basis for their position. Its not for lack of trying. So instead, they are just trying to fill the media with propagana.
the investigation found that these news outlets failed to provide information about the fossil fuel industry funding for these think tanks in two-thirds of the stories over the two-year period.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Bludgeon » Sun May 19, 2013 5:24 pm

DCB wrote:And then Huckleby reminded us of an example of a scientist who was skeptical of AGW, and who indeed did get grant money from noted deniers, including the Koch brothers.


Mein gott in himmel. Is there some scientific reason that this entire thread reads like a play-by-play of a play-by-play?
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby rabble » Sun May 19, 2013 6:53 pm

Bludgeon wrote:
DCB wrote:And then Huckleby reminded us of an example of a scientist who was skeptical of AGW, and who indeed did get grant money from noted deniers, including the Koch brothers.


Mein gott in himmel. Is there some scientific reason that this entire thread reads like a play-by-play of a play-by-play?

Yes, of course. It's because Meade can't read. I for one don't know why DCB bothered to explain it since Meade can't read the explanation any more than he could read the previous posts, but what the hell.
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Mad Howler » Sun May 19, 2013 9:58 pm

Deny
Delay
If your "arguments" are not being popularly accepted, then change the subject - dumb ass
-repeat the above over and over in any order.
It works.
Oh, and (MOST IMPORTANTLY) do not forget to accuse pesky folks you disagree with and wish to destroy - of things that you are already up to. This one, my friend, inexplicably keeps on working!
People are funny animals.
The high road is hard.
The prescription of the low road is so easy.
Why mess with the "perfection" of such dark arts?
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Meade » Mon May 20, 2013 9:49 am

Meade
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon May 20, 2013 3:19 pm

Sandi wrote:Global warming is a fact. The earth has warmed and cooled since it's existence, and it is presently not nearly as warm as many times in the past.

What those who want to blame global warming on human activity do is concentrate on the small recent increases in global temperatures. Well, even a few hundred years isn't a long enough period to measure meaningful changes. Global temperatures in any one hundred year period are not enough to even make a blip in the historical noise variance.

Humans may be indeed contributing, but if so, to what extent is guesswork at best. A few years ago I put together four videos. They are about ten minutes each, but informative, and easy to understand. Please watch them with an open mind.

http://madisonforum.net/wp/?p=1065
It always amazes me when someone quotes that science tells them the Earth has cooled and warmed before while at the same time deny that the very same scientists say Earth has never ever warmed even remotely this fast before: Temperature increases that used to take thousands of years has now happened in 40 years.

What's changed since then?
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Re: 97% Scientist Consensus: global warming is man-made

Postby Ned Flanders » Mon May 20, 2013 3:23 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:Temperature increases that used to take thousands of years has now happened in 40 years.

That would be news to people who endured the "Little Ice Age".
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