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is it so bizarre?

Bars, wine, beer, cocktails, drunken escapades

How do you like your beers served to you?

Give me a new glass every time. I hear that the dishwasher rinse that they use is good for your teeth.
4
11%
Donâ??t replace my glass. I like my beer to taste like the brewer intended, or as close to it as possible. And itâ??s more efficient.
14
39%
I don't care, just give me a beer.
18
50%
 
Total votes : 36

Postby Chuck_Schick » Fri May 12, 2006 3:53 pm

small cheese wrote:Have you tried skewering an olive with one of those little plastic pieces of shit? Sorry, but sometimes my fingers have to go in there.

What you need, friend, is one of these.

Just one of the many gizmos I wish I'd invented.
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Postby Violet_Skye » Sun May 14, 2006 8:08 pm

Hand sanitizers destroy only some types of viruses and bacteria, while leaving many others, which allows those others to proliferate unchecked. The best way to wash is with plain soap, scrubbing and rinsing thoroughly.
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Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Mon May 15, 2006 12:11 am

Violet_Skye wrote:Hand sanitizers destroy only some types of viruses and bacteria, while leaving many others, which allows those others to proliferate unchecked. The best way to wash is with plain soap, scrubbing and rinsing thoroughly.

Plain soap destroys only some types of viruses and bacteria, while leaving many others, which allows those others to proliferate unchecked. The best way to stay clean is to touch nothing, live in a bubble and cut your hands cut off at the wrists.

I mean, give me a break.
If hand sanitizers are good enough for hospital use (where they are commonly used as a substitute for soap), I'm sure they're good enough for bars, too. Besides, I never meant to suggest you should use only sanitizers (since as was already pointed out, they don't remove anything from your hands like scrubbing with soap does,) but if you're damaging your skin from constant washing, substituting sanitizer for some washes might help, dig?
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Postby Chuck_Schick » Mon May 15, 2006 11:44 am

Anyone who's taken a microbiology class will know that soap kills almost nothing, whereas the isopropyl alcohol that is the basis for hand sanitizers like Purell kills virtually all common bacteria on contact.

If you've got bacteria or viral agents on your hands that can stand up to an alcohol bath, I don't want to know where the fuck you're putting your mitts.
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Postby Beer Moon » Mon May 15, 2006 4:27 pm

Constant use of anti-bacterial agents has the added benefit of speeding up evolution.

Only the strongest bacteria and viruses will survive the alcohol bath, ensuring a stronger more powerful next generation.

Of course, the over 400 bacteria commonly found in the mouth are beneficial, so I assume we aren't talking about any of them.

Personally, I prefer they use the same glass if I'm drinking the same thing. I've only got one memory of having a bartender refill a used glass with light beer after it had been filled with stout, and it wasn't a big enough deal for me to say anything about it. I did notice it, and resolve to ask next time I switched from dark to light. Of course, I always forget, and since most bartenders get that one right, I don't think I've ever had to actually ask.

I don't really get Frostys either. I guess I prefer same glass because I figure it wastes less resources to rewash one every time. If I switch mixed drinks (vodka tonic to Jack & Coke), then I want a new glass. From a lager to a bitter/ale? Nah. Don't care. From Guiness to lager? Yes, new glass please. Or the rinse is fine. I'm not a fan of a WARM glass either though. Like one right out of the hot washer. Especially if the beer is not too cold to begin with.
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Postby DamnShame » Tue May 16, 2006 2:10 pm

Back to the original question: new glass or old...

When I visited Germany a few years back, they definately gave you a new glass every time
and they definately gave you the disgusted evil eye if you said,
"No, it's ok to use the old one."

The places I went also seemed to have a super high-power carbonation system that poured the beer very fast
(ostensibly on purpose - pourpose?-)
and then had to let it sit for a minute before they would pour a little more,
and let it sit again, and then pour a little more to top it off.

You had to order your next beer half way through your current one
just to have another by the time you were done with the first.
It doesn't take long to learn that trick.
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Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Tue May 16, 2006 4:11 pm

DamnShame wrote:When I visited Germany a few years back, they definately gave you a new glass every time
and they definately gave you the disgusted evil eye if you said,
"No, it's ok to use the old one."


This is one of the most ridiculous claims I've ever heard on the DPF.

Many German bars have walls covered with cubbyholes which their regular customers use to store their personal steins. They come in, give the server their stein number and that is the only vessel which ever touches their lips in that establishment. This is a tradition that dates back centuries.
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Postby destryscholes » Tue May 16, 2006 4:38 pm

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:
DamnShame wrote:When I visited Germany a few years back, they definately gave you a new glass every time
and they definately gave you the disgusted evil eye if you said,
"No, it's ok to use the old one."


This is one of the most ridiculous claims I've ever heard on the DPF.

Many German bars have walls covered with cubbyholes which their regular customers use to store their personal steins. They come in, give the server their stein number and that is the only vessel which ever touches their lips in that establishment. This is a tradition that dates back centuries.


This hardly rates on the DPF ridiculous scale. My experience in Germay was that they typically gave your glass a quick rinse with water before refilling it - the sensible response to the original question.
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Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Tue May 16, 2006 4:47 pm

destryscholes wrote: My experience in Germay was that they typically gave your glass a quick rinse with water before refilling it ...

That was my experience, as well.
The "ridiculous" part was that "they definately gave you the disgusted evil eye if you said, 'No, it's ok to use the old one.'" And I think my anecdote clearly demonstrates why for that to be true, hundreds of years of tradition would have to have been ignored.
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Postby bleurose » Tue May 30, 2006 2:34 pm

This whole thread has been pretty funny :D . Shelly gave a nice summary of microscopic organisms too. Actually, if you have a 40X (high dry) or 100X (oil immersion) lens on your microscope, you can see quite a few different types of bacteria and you can save your pocket electron microscope for the viral entities. I find that special stains really help highlight the bacterial buggers and I usually cut to that chase if I think I have that sort of teeny weeny to look at.

Two things: 1) I don't much care if the same glass is used as long as it was well rinsed to start with. Nothing much worse than that slight soapy aftertaste when you were looking forward to a good beer.

2) I hate to admit after all these years that my mother was right about washing my hands. Many days in my line of work I am elbow deep (& sometimes knee deep as well) in really nasty stuff. And sometimes, it gets ALL over (forgot to put that face shield on AGAIN!) despite my best efforts. So I wash my hands (arms, face, neck) A LOT and I seldom get sick. Do I get "germs" from my work? Highly likely although nothing serious has been found in screening serologies. I look on it as a way to keep my immune system interested & engaged. Same for using the same beer glass.

I forget if it was Mr. Schick or Professor W. who said that handwashing kills very few, if any, microbes. Quite right. But the mechanical action of hand rubbing, lathering & rinsing sends most of the invisible stuff down the drain. Whether it/they are dead or not doesn't much matter as long as they are no longer hanging out on your hands (or, some days, my face :shock: ). You get the picture. Article a while back (few years at least) in Emerging Disease about the efficacy of "antibacterial hand soap". Interestingly, the compound in such products, at the concentration present in said products (look on the label for that) requires a MINIMUM contact time of 30 minutes - yup, one half hour - to kill one half of the usual flora found on average hands. Don't know about anyone else, but I'm not gonna stand there for half an hour with anything on my hands each time I wash up :roll: .
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Postby DamnShame » Wed May 31, 2006 8:52 am

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:
DamnShame wrote:When I visited Germany a few years back, they definately gave you a new glass every time
and they definately gave you the disgusted evil eye if you said,
"No, it's ok to use the old one."


This is one of the most ridiculous claims I've ever heard on the DPF.


Well whooppee for you.
I was just relating what I experienced on one trip to Duetschland.
Granted, I didn't visit every pub and it may not be the national standard.
Perhaps I just experienced a bout of snobbery on par with your own.
It is simply my recollection of what happened in my singular experience.
Feel free to kiss my ass.
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Postby Cory Schmidt » Wed Jun 07, 2006 5:40 pm

I am surprised that this is an issue for all of you. I have never given it a thought when ordering a beer.
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Postby SombreroFallout » Sat Jul 29, 2006 12:58 am

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:
DamnShame wrote:When I visited Germany a few years back, they definately gave you a new glass every time
and they definately gave you the disgusted evil eye if you said,
"No, it's ok to use the old one."


This is one of the most ridiculous claims I've ever heard on the DPF.

Many German bars have walls covered with cubbyholes which their regular customers use to store their personal steins. They come in, give the server their stein number and that is the only vessel which ever touches their lips in that establishment. This is a tradition that dates back centuries.


Now, let's not conflate Germania with Monolith-uania.

I agree wholeheartedly that it's flat-out absurd -- minimum -- to worry and fret about pathogens in one's beer. The whole point of fermentation is to off the little nasties, so there's that. The whallop from a 3- or 5- or 8-drink evening really renders any risk null. Worrying about germs, though: that's a pathology.

I'm willing to wager your average modern German has moved on to glassware sometime during the last century, and isn't loitering around in lederhosen in dim Stiftskellers sucking on pewter-lidded, baroque Bavarian BierSteins. Yes, of course, EssenHaus arrangements persist.

Not contradictory at all: Aren't they just different rituals aiming for the same result? Beneath the charming veneer of elaborately decorated stein, stocking, and stiftskeller lurks the stout carl, the rude swain -- the Germanic urge to posess: Nein! Warum trinken Sie von meinem stein?

Ya got the fancy lid to keep the flies out. Check. Ya got a mug to call your very own. Check. A German's set, cause the beer's a given.

And after all: Who'd want the pustule-spattered lips of your random syphilitic Saxon gumming the rim of the mug of which you've grown so fond?

Same mania for order, control/separation, and sterility in compulsively dunking every glass every time in a chemical bath. It's the condition their condition's in. I completely believe DamnShame got the evil eye for not going along with The Program.

Myself. I drink the beer. And I don't mind a frosty glass, because it's gotta be cold. And it's gotta be carbonated. If there are naturally-occurring flora & fauna along for the ride, the healthier I'll be as exposure strengthens my immune system. Microbial consortia! Good for what ales ya!

But I always use the same glass. I will go out of my way to get bartenders to reuse my glass. Fresh glasses waste their time and mine.

The chemical residue in some joints is horrendous. The Plaza was a particularly vile offender: they served Bud, and the sterilizer solution not only totally overwhelmed the taste of the beer, it turned it blue. It took at least two taps to redeem the glass -- which did nothing about the Dow chemical plant now operating in your mouth.

I figure, even if other joints use less sanitizer, that second pint is still cleaner after the first has picked up the relatively sane residue levels.

And for all the folks worried 'bout germs? Take a closer look at the dunk tanks sometime. It's late in the evenin', they're movin' fast, there's spillage, you can't change tanks just on a whim . . . -- I mean, don't get me wrong: the system works; this happens at every restaurant. But really, the chemical cure is worse than the disease: I once knew a guy whose young hippy customer base would interrogate him about whether the blotter they bought was stamped with non-toxic ink. Annoyed him no end. Here they were hellbent on plugging their frontal lobes into a lysergic power plant, and they wanted to make sure that was soy-based ink on their bleach-processed paper. Go figure.
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Postby Marvell » Sat Jul 29, 2006 11:39 am

SombreroFallout wrote:I once knew a guy whose young hippy customer base would interrogate him about whether the blotter they bought was stamped with non-toxic ink. Annoyed him no end. Here they were hellbent on plugging their frontal lobes into a lysergic power plant, and they wanted to make sure that was soy-based ink on their bleach-processed paper. Go figure.


That's great.

I was in Columbus, Ohio in the summer of 1986, visiting Ken and Doug, a couple friends of mine from high school. We ended up taking some blotter, each hit of which was decorated with a miniature facsimile of the cover of Journey's Escape.

Bleeaacchhh. Those two mooks always did have the shittiest taste.
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Postby SombreroFallout » Sat Jul 29, 2006 1:51 pm

Marvell wrote:
SombreroFallout wrote:I once knew a guy whose young hippy customer base would interrogate him about whether the blotter they bought was stamped with non-toxic ink. Annoyed him no end. Here they were hellbent on plugging their frontal lobes into a lysergic power plant, and they wanted to make sure that was soy-based ink on their bleach-processed paper. Go figure.


That's great.

I was in Columbus, Ohio in the summer of 1986, visiting Ken and Doug, a couple friends of mine from high school. We ended up taking some blotter, each hit of which was decorated with a miniature facsimile of the cover of Journey's Escape.

Bleeaacchhh. Those two mooks always did have the shittiest taste.


Mistaking a trip for a journey seems such a harmless error.
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