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R.I.P. Good n Loud

Who's making noise in and around Madison? What's new in the business of making music around town? Review shows and CDs here. Please keep all hype in Hype Exchange.

Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby NullDevice » Tue Dec 14, 2010 7:48 pm

It needs a mom-n-pop store that, uh, carries things. And has decent service.

I don't usually shop at GC, but I'll order from Sweetwater or Zzounds or whatever simply because they've got a selection and cost a lot less.

By that token I wonder how Ward Brodt stays afloat. They have nothing and it all costs an arm-and-a-leg.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby Nate535 » Tue Dec 14, 2010 8:51 pm

The only thing you really have right is horrible mismanagement. The ownership wasn't savy enough to understand that the landscape of that industry was going to quickly be changing. They didn't realize it until it was too late and they made a bad decision to invest in another location instead of a quality online presence and more lesson studios. The reason Good n Loud failed is mostly because the mom and pop brick and mortar model doesn't work for a music store in this small of a market. The plain and simple fact is that online stores can make money selling at profit margins that brick and mortar stores can't. If the economy is so bad, why is Full Compass growing? It's a factor no doubt but this is more of a business model issue than an economy issue.

What really put GnL out of business was competition in the lessons market. Madison Music Foundry took a lot of great instructors and a lot of current and potential students who represented a huge profit center for the store. Having fewer student means having fewer regular customers so they get hit twice. The second store was a good idea but they should have just built a huge lesson facility and sold small items, packs, and accessories. The bigger issue is more likely that the cost of the prime real estate of the second location was never going to give them a good ROI.

Something you should all understand is that Good n Loud and the other Mom n Pops didn't lose Fender...Fender stopped supporting smaller stores (who made them the name they are) by making it impossible to afford to carry their products. First Gibson then Fender required such huge financial commitments to carry their products that smaller entities could not afford to do so. If you wanted to get Mexican Strats (which you could sell like hot cakes) you'd also have to stock all the other bullshit that Fender has that doesn't sell for shit. That means as a business you have to tie a bunch of money up in high end amps and guitars (that don't sell very frequently) and a lot of crappy merchandise (like fender acoustics). In order to be successful as a small shop you need a certain amount of cash flow. Fender wouldn't allow small shops to make smaller investments or to choose the items that fit their market. What happened with Good n Loud? They had too much money tied up in Fender products that wouldn't sell (because the market just couldn't absorb the volume of products) and as a result, couldn't pay Fender and couldn't bring in the stuff that would sell (read: Mexican Strats). Of course, if GnL would have dropped Fender (like Ward-Brodt), everyone would be bitching about how lame the products are. It didn't help that both Fender an Gibson were buying up every name brand they could get their hands on (and completely ruining what used to be great products)

fisticuffs wrote:All of the above. The economy number one though. In tough times things like music are the first to suffer. People still tend to buy food and gas but guitars? Guitar Center has to be another big one. Horrible mismanagement by the ownership? That second store was a money pit and an awful idea to begin with. Throw in the fact that there were bills going unpaid long before they opened it. They lost a lot of their best lines. Fender dropped them years ago and along with Fender goes Jackson, Charvel, SWR, Gretsch, and Guild. You can only sell so many generic Chinese knock offs that no ones ever heard of.
We need a good music store but I don't know that anyone should go and open one in this climate. We've got Best Buy (I don't know anyone who's ever actually bought anything there) GC is probably taking most of the business, Ward Brodt all but closed down the combo department, Ginter's is great for seasoned nerds but no so much for mom and dad buying a starter guitar. Full Compass has a lot more than you think they do but not really a traditional music store by any means. You can go in and try stuff though.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby Henry Vilas » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:09 pm

guitarist3 wrote:That would be Keith Richards on the side of the building not Jeff Beck.

My mistake. They both looked a lot better when they were young.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby droidsattack » Tue Dec 14, 2010 11:47 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Even their chimney has history.


Man, I forgot about that whole thing. I was a part of a little "band camp" after school program at GNL back about 20 years ago when that story was still somewhat current. From what I understood it was an attempted robbery. I didn't know the guy they found was a dude in a dress and his body was never identified. Weird.

Jason, all that mis-management/economic climate/NON-line presence talk is all bullshit. It was the curse of the drag queen bandit.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby Average Joe » Tue Dec 14, 2010 11:52 pm

droidsattack wrote:
Jason, all that mis-management/economic climate/NON-line presence talk is all bullshit. It was the curse of the drag queen bandit.


Au contraire, it was the blessing of the dead drag queen Santa that allowed them to survive for 30 years.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby HeyZeus » Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:19 am

Good-n-Loud, Guitar Center and Ward Brodt. All are the sucks, imo.

Cascio/Interstate Music in Milwaukee needs to open a store here and offer musicians good products and (gasp) good customer service.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby fisticuffs » Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:09 am

Yeah Fender is a beast and I'm not sure I'd ever even want to have to deal with Gibson. With the shrinking dealer base and bad economy Fender at least has had to put the brakes on the unreasonable demands a little. Wasn't a lot of that money tied up in Masterbuilt monstrosities? Were those required? It's sad that MMF took so much of the lesson business away but can you really complain about the job Mike has done with that place? I can't think of a single bad thing to say about it. You can't understate what a strong lesson program can do for a retailer though. Times change. Hopefully someday something really great can rise from the ashes here but it's not going to be easy and it's not going to survive without offering something new.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby Kyle Motor » Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:31 am

I would love to see a store with a solid used department for guitars/amps/drums, etc. With the notable exception of Ginter's, used stuff has pretty much dried up in town. I still miss Music-Go-Round for that aspect.

But then again, I'm guessing it's tough to get decent used stock with competition from Craigslist/ebay/etc.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby supaunknown » Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:49 pm

Somebody should drag the Regenberg bros out of retirement. Now more than ever.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby juanton » Wed Dec 15, 2010 1:28 pm

supaunknown wrote:Somebody should drag the Regenberg bros out of retirement. Now more than ever.


Yes!

They could hire back the blonde hair 80s dude that used to work there. You know, the guy with shoulder length blonde hair and bangs. Odd character.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby indycoyote » Wed Dec 15, 2010 9:55 pm

This is sad. I've been in GnL a few times in the past year and they really had shit for inventory. Ya just can't sell strings and get by. At least Ginter has Sid, and his biz seems to be booming, though I have to wonder how long Greg can make a run of it with his health issues. I'm hoping a long time yet! There is NO WORSE EXPERIENCE than going into Guitar Center. It's more unpleasant than a colonoscopy prep, and at least you get peace of mind from the fucking colonoscopy! The folks at GnL have done a lot for Madison's music scene over the past 30 years, in more ways than they might realize.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby Nate535 » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:04 pm

I think they bought the masterbuilt stuff when times were good, but the only place you can sell that stuff is at guitar shows to collectors.

Good N Loud used to have really great gear. They always had an amazing selection of amps from popular production models from Fender and Marshall to some really great higher end stuff like Tone King, Rivera, Mesa Boogie and a good number of handwired pieces. The only problem was that none of the musicians in town ever bought any of it. They made an effort to stock real gear and it end up hurting them in the long run.

I've got no beef with MMF, I know a lot of the instructors there who I used to teach with and they have nothing but good things to say about the place. I've also recorded in one of the rooms there and it was a great experience.

The used shop business model is another one that just doesn't work in todays market. It used to be hard to sell used gear yourself because it was hard to get your stuff in front of potential buyers. You don't have to take out a classified ad anymore because at any time any of us can be connected with hundreds...maybe thousands of potential buyers. Not only did this kill the classified money that papers were getting, but guitar shops no longer had any leverage to talk people into selling their gear to them for half of what it's worth. The fact that people always think their gear is worth way more than it ever is only adds to the trouble.

fisticuffs wrote:Yeah Fender is a beast and I'm not sure I'd ever even want to have to deal with Gibson. With the shrinking dealer base and bad economy Fender at least has had to put the brakes on the unreasonable demands a little. Wasn't a lot of that money tied up in Masterbuilt monstrosities? Were those required? It's sad that MMF took so much of the lesson business away but can you really complain about the job Mike has done with that place? I can't think of a single bad thing to say about it. You can't understate what a strong lesson program can do for a retailer though. Times change. Hopefully someday something really great can rise from the ashes here but it's not going to be easy and it's not going to survive without offering something new.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby HeyZeus » Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:17 am

Kyle Motor wrote: I still miss Music-Go-Round for that aspect.


Back in the early days, maybe.

MGR turned into a complete shit hole. Even before they moved to Watts Road.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby defactobrigade » Thu Dec 16, 2010 5:20 am

Guitar Shop of Wisconsin is a good guitar shop. Idk, it's crammed in and full so don't bring a crew. And I honestly didn't know that was the name of it until right now when I tried to figure it out. But it's the one over on Atwood. I'd recommend it as a good little stop if yr looking to kill some time. I bought a fuse there cuz I blew one out recording once and he had it upstairs, so he got it and it was super cheap. end of story.
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Re: R.I.P. Good n Loud

Postby iwiw99 » Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:44 am

Ahh, the Regenbergs. Those were great times and I hope they are doing Ok. Dave would educate and sell me as only Dave could. When Dave turned his back, Dick would extend credit. It was a sweet deal. I learned a ton and still have some classic gear that Dave steered me towards. The fellow with the hair was Scott, a truly nice guy. They SHOULD get back into the business. For them it is probably a time that has passed.
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