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Klimate Kooks Kaught

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby TimeMasterFlex » Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:41 am

Global warming and climate change is normal.

It does not matter if humans helped speed it up, it is still a normal process of the Earth.

Humans can do nothing to stop it, it is going to happen if we interfere or not.

Live with it.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby Ned Flanders » Tue Dec 21, 2010 10:42 am

Average Joe wrote:In case you didn't notice, I have not abandoned my presumption that Ned is a sock puppet.

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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby DCB » Thu Dec 23, 2010 2:19 pm

It was silly for Viner to make such definitive predictions - and it is just as silly to point to a single snowstorm as evidence for or against a changing climate. Or to point to a single researcher's comment as summarizing climate change research.

However this part of the article is factual:
a trend that has been increasingly visible in the past 15 years: in the south of England
, for instance, from 1970 to 1995 snow and sleet fell for an average of 3.7 days, while from 1988 to 1995 the average was 0.7 days. London's last substantial snowfall was in February 1991.

Trend (my emphasis) is the operative word here.
It would be interesting to update this report with last 15 years of data.

Ned Flanders wrote:Now that much of Europe and good parts of the good 'ol USA are in teh midst of yet another snowy, cold winter, I present a blast from the past :lol: :

Snowfalls are now just a thing of the past

By Charles Onians
Monday, 20 March 2000
http://www.independent.co.uk/environmen ... 24017.html
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby buckyor » Thu Dec 23, 2010 9:54 pm

I'd like to say that Ned's ignorance of the difference between weather and climate exposes him as a complete dumbass, but what it really demonstrates (yet again) is that he's simply reading from the script given to him by his GOP employers.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby DCB » Thu Dec 23, 2010 11:55 pm

buckyor wrote:I'd like to say that Ned's ignorance of the difference between weather and climate exposes him as a complete dumbass, but what it really demonstrates (yet again) is that he's simply reading from the script given to him by his GOP employers.


Yeah, but its effective, no? Over two pages of name-calling resulting from total lame-o trolling.

If Viner's short-term predictions had show up in the IPCC report, or even any peer-reviewed article, we'd have something substantive to talk about. The only thing we can really say about a 10-year-old news article is that some of the researchers at the CRU are prone to shoot their mouth off.

Anyway, as long we're looking at localized weather events, how about Russia? For those with short memories: it was hot last Summer.
http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/2010/ ... ng-russia/
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby Galoot » Fri Dec 24, 2010 12:06 am

I'm betting that Neddy or one of the other trolls will bring up a recent NASA paper, claiming that it shows that global warming will be half as much of an impact as the IPCC claims.

Of course, the NASA paper says nothing of the sort.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby Average Joe » Fri Dec 24, 2010 12:49 am

Just about everyone of the weather extremes that have manifested in the past decade or so were predicted and warned of by climatologists who have studied human associated carbon impact on the environment and climate change. Just saying, but if your defense (Ned) of the current climate change you ridicule (Ned) is based on "it's just a coincidence" you really are playing a game of Russian roulette. Exactly how long will you feel comfortable playing that game when the catastrophic results are becoming more and more destructive, regular and obvious? I realize for simpletons (Ned) it's hard to connect the dots between car exhaust with monsoon rains in San Diego, but the scientist you (Ned) ridicule with your 5th grade education predicted it.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby jonnygothispen » Wed Dec 29, 2010 1:01 pm

The average CO2 level for hundreds of thousands of years was 280 ppm with peaks at 320 from volcanic activity (Data taken from tests of air pockets in accurately dated glacial ice). The current average is 395 ppm.

Some say that the Antarctic has more ice now than it has in the past, and it's true that the average temp over the antarctic is cooler than normal, and there is more ice on the surface. But they also ignore that the Antarctic has lost record amounts of ice at the same time due to warmer ocean temperatures. Coupled with a 30% loss of ice in the Arctic in 30 years, record time, this tells you that the Earth as a whole is definitely getting much warmer, much faster than ever before, w/o any further study needed.

Climate change deniers argue that this is natural, that temperatures have risen and fallen throughout history. What they fail to mention is that it took thousands of years for the same temp drops and rises that only took150 years to happen now, coinciding with the huge increase in the use of coal/industrial age, and other man made causes.

Then there are feedback loops that also confuse the issue at first: Warmer temps allow higher ocean winds that exposes water with higher levels of CO2 for evaporation; high levels of CO2 cause plants to close their pores due to overload slowing photosynthesis, but retaining water and causing greater growth in some areas; solar winds; moving North and South poles; release of methane (10 times more potent to warming) due to the thawing of previously frozen swamps, etc.

Overall, anyone who's serious about the science behind it realizes this is a real problem.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby jonnygothispen » Wed Dec 29, 2010 1:24 pm

And this: http://www.news.wisc.edu/16083
...human-induced climate change began not 200 years ago, but thousands of years ago with the onset of large-scale agriculture in Asia and extensive deforestation in Europe...

"No one disputes the large rate of increase in greenhouse gases with the Industrial Revolution," Kutzbach notes. "The large-scale burning of coal for industry has swamped everything else" in the record.

"Between 5,000 and 8,000 years ago, both methane and carbon dioxide started an upward trend, unlike during previous interglacial periods," ...the accumulation of greenhouse gases over the past few thousands of years... is very likely forestalling the onset of a new glacial cycle, such as have occurred at regular 100,000-year intervals during the last million years. Each glacial period has been paced by regular and predictable changes in the orbit of the Earth known as Milankovitch cycles...
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby Ned Flanders » Wed Dec 29, 2010 5:36 pm

My, my. "Global cooling", the 70's-era panic, morphed into "global warming" in the 80's which morphed into "climate change" in the 00's.

As Algore said, there's a sucka born every minute.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby jonnygothispen » Wed Dec 29, 2010 5:48 pm

Ned Flanders wrote:My, my. "Global cooling", the 70's-era panic, morphed into "global warming" in the 80's which morphed into "climate change" in the 00's.

As Algore said, there's a sucka born every minute.
Except that they knew the cooling was a temporary phase, save for what was it? One article, I think.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby rabble » Wed Dec 29, 2010 5:53 pm

Ned Flanders wrote:As Algore said, there's a sucka born every minute.

It is difficult for conservatives to grasp the idea of "new information" which can "change" conclusions. For them, if the new information doesn't support the conclusions, it's not credible.
In many cultures, one tries to avoid this behavior:
When a man finds a conclusion agreeable, he accepts it without argument, but when he finds it disagreeable, he will bring against it all the forces of logic and reason.
Thucydides

But for the Neds of the world, and I'm still in awe of how many Neds there are out there, it's the bible and those whose decisions and actions change as knowledge increases are "suckas."

And that's a shame.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby DCB » Thu Dec 30, 2010 6:35 pm

Ned Flanders wrote:My, my. "Global cooling", the 70's-era panic, morphed into "global warming" in the 80's which morphed into "climate change" in the 00's.

As Algore said, there's a sucka born every minute.


On the one hand we have a single 'global cooling' article in newsweek.
On the other hand we have 20 years of peer-review research by the overwhelming majority of climate scientists, supporting 'global warming'.
And on the third hand, you have an elected official quoting Genesis.

I guess a total idiot could be easily confused by the 'controversy'.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby fennel » Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:11 pm

DCB wrote:
Ned Flanders wrote:My, my. "Global cooling", the 70's-era panic, morphed into "global warming" in the 80's which morphed into "climate change" in the 00's.

...
On the other hand we have 20 years of peer-review research by the overwhelming majority of climate scientists, supporting 'global warming'. ...
This calls to mind the Flat-Earthers who thought themselves vindicated when it was determined that the earth wasn't a sphere, exactly. In fact, it was an oblate spheroid! ("You see? Those Round-Earthers will wrong all along!") ... Except that they weren't.
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Re: Klimate Kooks Kaught

Postby DCB » Fri Feb 25, 2011 11:46 am

DCB wrote:
DCB wrote:
I'm not usually given to making predictions. But I'm going to predict that Penn State will determine that Mann didn't exagerrate anything, and his work is just fine.


and one more time for good measure
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/25/scien ... .html?_r=1

so lets review:
* there is no fraud
* the science is real
* Inhofe is still stupid
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