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This Solomon situation

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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby Meade » Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:39 am

jjoyce wrote:The Cap Times has a hard-to-read story about the allegations against Ald. Brian Solomon this morning.

http://host.madison.com/ct/news/local/c ... 03286.html

There's a lot not to like in that report and I don't really want to get into the sexual assault stuff at all. What I'm amazed by is how these alders apparently pack away the booze.

What's not in dispute is how, following a council meeting, the alders adjourned to Brocach. I understand that's SOP and it's probably good for the city that political combatants can rub elbows immediately afterwards at the tavern. But then a small group extended the evening with a trip to the Bayou for Hurricanes. Ever had one? Ever had two? Not many have two and then exercise good judgment. Apparently, at least one alder thought it was acceptable to drive in this state and another announced that he needed to "sober up" before driving home.

Nice.

It's encouraging that some on the council -- Cnare and Bidar-Sielaff -- are working toward defining ethical boundaries, but it's amazing that it hasn't been done sooner. Anyone who has any knowledge of workplace ethics and safety would recognize a downtown bar crawl as something to avoid.


I want to apologize to Jason for derailing his thread.

Reading back over his original post in which he links to an article at the Cap Times that includes several paragraphs discussing the inconsistencies of the positions taken by elected public officials such as Lisa Subeck, council President Lauren Cnare and Ald. Shiva Bidar-Sielaff, I realize now that Jason wanted this thread to cover only the topic of the ethical boundaries of alcoholic behavior.

I was mistaken to not read Jason's FAQ page and try to understand his unwritten rule to not leave a comment that does not contribute directly to the cluster circle of self-nicknamed members of Jason's personal little forum club.

I regret the error. Please carry on with your collective digital webmasterly workmanship.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby bdog » Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:42 am

lukpac wrote:No, that isn't calling for Solomon to resign, but it is hardly "standing by Ald. Solomon" either.

I agree. Good work finding that lukpac.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby kurt_w » Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:11 am

Meade wrote:Henry Vilas (as if your name really is Henry Vilas), I was [...]

Ya are welcome for the answer, scratch.
(As if your real name is scratch.)
[...]

Henry Vilas (as if your name is really Henry Vilas), you, sir [...]

unless your name really is Henry Vilas, Henry Vilas, signing your name "Henry Vilas" would be, it seems to me, wrong [...]

My deepest and most profound apologies, radboy (as if your name is really radboy). [...]

That goes for Henry too (as if his name really is Henry). [...]

And O.J.(as if your name really is O.J. [...]

(No, I know your real name isn't rabble... it's just the "foron" nickname you gave yourself.) [...]

[...] circle of self-nicknamed members of Jason's personal little forum club [...]


WTF? This guy is really, really obsessed with the names thing.

Most of the wingnuts here pick something a bit less ... trivial ... for their Ahab-like obsessions. For Peanut it's labor unions, for Fester it's Islam, for Carol it was ... uh ... an Illuminati-like conspiracy involving public health doctors, the Ivy League, unitarians, Nazis, Bolsheviks, and obscure 19th century American philanthropists. For "Meade" it's people who use pseudonyms on the Internet.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby David Blaska » Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:15 pm

[Nov. 17 letter from Lisa Subeck]
lukpac wrote:No, that isn't calling for Solomon to resign, but it is hardly "standing by Ald. Solomon" either.


Good for Lisa Subeck! (Wondering why Jason brought up her name and hers only.) That's one down and most of the local Prog political establishment (including the DailyPage Forum) to go. Why is it so hard for Jason Joyce, The (Former) Kathleen, Lauren Cnare, Snoqueen, lukpac, fisti, johnny go et al. to say what Lisa Subeck said?
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby lukpac » Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:21 pm

I find it amusing that you think Cnare is part of the "Prog political establishment".
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby rabble » Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:22 pm

kurt_w wrote:
Meade wrote:real name, real name, real name, et cetera


WTF? This guy is really, really obsessed with the names thing.

Most of the wingnuts here pick something a bit less ... trivial ... for their Ahab-like obsessions. For Peanut it's labor unions, for Fester it's Islam, for Carol it was ... uh ... an Illuminati-like conspiracy involving public health doctors, the Ivy League, unitarians, Nazis, Bolsheviks, and obscure 19th century American philanthropists. For "Meade" it's people who use pseudonyms on the Internet.

To be fair, it's only for people he doesn't like. bdog is a good dog, so he gets told he's likeable.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby swimmingupstream » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:21 pm

radboy wrote:Scott Walker would trade both of his wife's nuts to get picked as a Vice-President candidate. They are all craven whores. Duh!

I am pretty sure women do not have testicles.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby rabble » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:37 pm

swimmingupstream wrote:
radboy wrote:Scott Walker would trade both of his wife's nuts to get picked as a Vice-President candidate. They are all craven whores. Duh!

I am pretty sure women do not have testicles.

I believe both of the above statements are true.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby radboy » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:32 pm

swimmingupstream wrote:
radboy wrote:Scott Walker would trade both of his wife's nuts to get picked as a Vice-President candidate. They are all craven whores. Duh!

I am pretty sure women do not have testicles.

I thought it was obvious. But I will spell it out for you. Walker would get the Koch Bros. to pay to have them grafted on and then trade them.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby indycoyote » Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:06 pm

Prestidigitation! Really? Ummm...yeah....that IS the crux of the matter here.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby lukpac » Thu Jan 05, 2012 11:29 am

David Blaska wrote:LUKPAC, and all other Progs, bumping and simplifying the question:

It was the right call for Prosser to resign in the midst of an investigation before all the facts were in?

But standing by Ald. Solomon case after the facts are in and the prosecutor says he is a victimizer is also justified?


http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/ ... b92bb.html

A group of Madison City Council and Dane County Board members want Ald. Brian Solomon to resign over allegations he sexually harassed and assaulted an assistant city clerk.

In a two-page letter, released to the State Journal Wednesday night, six City Council and two County Board members said they believe Solomon acted inappropriately, abused his position, broke the law, showed no remorse and should resign immediately.
[...]
“This is not OK. It’s not OK for an elected official to get away with this,” said Ald. Lisa Subeck, 1st District, who organized the letter seeking Solomon’s resignation. “We have a responsibility to hold ourselves to high professional standards. Brian did not hold himself to high ethical standards or hold himself to standards of professionalism. The only way to resolve that is for him to step aside and resign. The integrity of the (council) is at stake.”

The move would show city staff and citizens that harassment and assault, especially by an elected official, aren’t tolerated, Subeck said.

Alds. Bridget Maniaci, Chris Schmidt, Tim Bruer, Steve King and Mark Clear also signed the letter, along with county Sups. Analiese Eicher and Carousel Bayrd, who lives in Solomon’s district.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby bdog » Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:54 am

Solomon fires back

Brian Solomon wrote:However, there are only two reasons this lives on and both are a result of council actions: the decision to pursue a code of conduct and the crafting of the resignation request letter.


Brian, there's a 3rd reason. Even if the rape accusations are false, the eyewitness testimonies prove you're a scumball.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby lukpac » Sun Jan 08, 2012 1:06 pm

bdog wrote:Brian, there's a 3rd reason. Even if the rape accusations are false, the eyewitness testimonies prove you're a scumball.


They prove it? How so?
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby bdog » Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:10 pm

From the letter asking him to resign:

We find your actions highly disconcerting. Here are three examples highlighting our concerns:

1. On the night of the alleged assault, you followed Ms. Berg into the women’s bathroom at a local bar and only left after one of your colleagues asked you to. You deny this happened, despite eyewitness accounts from neutral parties.

2. You admit to having to carry Ms. Berg part of the way from the bar to her car at the end of the night because she was too drunk to walk. Yet, you insist that she was not intoxicated two hours later when you arrived at her home where the alleged assault took place. The Department of Justice disagrees that Ms. Berg was sober at the time of the alleged assault. Given her behavior and her physical stature, it is not reasonable to claim that she would have become sober within 2 hours.

3. You sent Ms. Berg harassing emails while she was sitting across from you working for the city during a city council meeting. Ms. Berg ignored your emailed advances, but you continued by commenting on her looks and asking her what she was doing after work.

You have not expressed any remorse.


Based on this, Solomon is a scumball, IMHO.
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Re: This Solomon situation

Postby snoqueen » Sun Jan 08, 2012 3:59 pm

My takeaway, after reading a lot of comments and reports:

I've come to the conclusion these two people deserved each other. They both got way too drunk. Solomon followed Berg into a women's bathroom, and apparently drove drunk. They were seen together, drunk and apparently enjoying one another's company, looking for their lost keys. Berg invited Solomon into her house, he spent the night and nobody can sort out what happened because it's he-said/she-said and because drunk people often can't remember too well. And afterward, Berg surprised Solomon with serious legal accusations and a publicized very detailed account of their sexual activity that'll surely haunt him for years.

1) Nobody behaved well here.

2) Thorough investigations by neutral, experienced investigators find no prosecutable crimes.

3) Solomon needs to quit getting over-served and chasing around with drunk women. I said before this sounds like a typical "I got drunk in a bar" behavior, and it was. He's not a criminal, and he's human. I don't know how old he is, but by time you're in your mid- to late-twenties and in front of the public eye, you need to get a grip.

Any public figure needs to keep his personal activities in line with the idea he's under public scrutiny and has public responsibilities. If that wasn't clear before, it is now, because we all can see what happens when someone doesn't. The public gobbles up these stories more greedily than it probably should, but that's how our society is. I tend to be pretty forgiving of human behavior, but I'm in the minority and again, I've got to take into account how society is.

4) And any man who goes out with Berg had better have his lawyer all lined up. Seriously. This woman is not date material -- she sounds like a character from a movie and like every guy's worst nightmare. After all this, nobody sensible is going to date either one of these people with a ten foot pole. And that's how society is, too. Your history follows you these days, and nothing can be erased.

5) Every instance is different, and over the years we've had an unending parade of public-figure-embarrassments. People still do dumb stuff, from presidents and senators right down to locals. I hope the Council doesn't waste too much time trying to write some new totally air-tight standards, because it won't change that fact.
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