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What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Bludgeon » Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:16 pm

Donald wrote:Just a little note here about the power of governors. Be careful about generalizing. The Texas Constitution imparts very little power on the position of Governor, while Wisconsin's Constitution provides the office of Governor with immense power. States are not all the same.


I agree, though I think our notion of Texas' underpowered executive chair is a little too generalized. State congress passes the bills, governor does or does not sign them, no? I'm not saying its because of a governor that Silicon Valley is migrating south, but we can agree that business climates are what make states attractive, and those climates come from a state's gubernatorial and legislative tradition to a large extent, among other things.

Ironically its red state policies that bring business in; but those businesses, creating jobs, bring truckloads of blue state college grads. I'm starting to look at it as a natural harmony: the conservative infrastructure attracts businesses; those businesses create jobs; those jobs attract socially liberal college students/grads; you end up with a thriving state with a low cost of living, good paying jobs, and an evolving social outlook. Ten years from now those 24 year olds will be wanting to preserve their economic model as well as evolve social norms; to me that's about the perfect mix.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:57 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:Sorry, I got carried away...

Your straw man is the idea that Governor's have nothing to do with the debt when in fact they present the main ideas for the budget every time and legislature modifies it. You even claimed it wasn't true. Obviously it does depend on the make up of the legislature for each Governor, however they do set patterns by what they propose.


Did Henry lend you his copy of the Clinton playbook? Chapter Two: "Just tell a lie and not worry about it?" (Incidentally, it's the same title as Chapter Three, Chapter Four and Chapter Five.)

When did I say Governor's have nothing to do with debt? Let's go to the video tape! Oh my, it looks like I said "Any blame for debt, or credit for reducing it, ought to take into account all of the players, both legislative and executive."
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:25 am

Dangerousman wrote:
The entire tactic of calling it "Thompson's debt" or "Doyle's debt" really amounts to an evasion of the truth. No Wisconsin governor has been a king who single-handedly decreed budgets and legislation. ...
Again, this is your straw man since the immediate issue here is a Governor that did set the tone , and with a Republican controlled legislature, got almost exactly what he wanted except when not politically viable to the Fitzgeralds or whomever. Let me use your strategy on you. Nowhere did I say that Governors "single-handedly" create the debt, however, I did qualify the statement with the fact that they present a budget that is generally accepted, and in the immediate example of Scott Walker, in spades. There was no "evasion of the truth." You simply made that up rather than looking at the fact that Scott Walker's budget increased Wisconsin's debt because HE borrowed $558 million. In other words, you created a straw man, by distorting what I said to fit what you think and drew attention away from the immediate problem of increased debt under Scott Walker's budget. Your last straw man is to compare me to someone else you dislike here. Your debate style is often an endless stream of straw men...

Do you think you could possibly grow up just a little bit instead of using simple mind games? Thanks
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:20 am

jonnygothispen wrote:Do you think you could possibly grow up just a little bit instead of using simple mind games? Thanks


I laughed out loud when I read this coming from you of all people. So, you consider presenting the truth to be a "mind game?"
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:29 pm

of course you laughed, that's your 4th straw man. And coming from a self described "mature adult" who spends his time on a website challenging "liberals" because he "can't stand the bullshit," more accurately, the voices in your head, because you're not actually mature enough to allow people to think what they will without wanting some sort of control over them. Thanks again for exposing your childish psyche... Wondering what your next straw man will be?
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:49 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:of course you laughed, that's your 4th straw man. And coming from a self described "mature adult" who spends his time on a website challenging "liberals" because he "can't stand the bullshit," more accurately, the voices in your head, because you're not actually mature enough to allow people to think what they will without wanting some sort of control over them. Thanks again for exposing your childish psyche... Wondering what your next straw man will be?


Why don't you try a level of maturity that doesn't feel so threatened by a challenge to your beliefs? I love having my beliefs challenged, they have a better foundation as a result. You get all whiny because you're afraid the fraudulent basis for them will be exposed.

I'm challenging liberals? No, only the stupid ones, just as I would challenge stupid conservatives.

And you are hardly the person to talk about control over other people. I am willing to respect levels of freedom far beyond what you indicate you're willing to do. You want control over every aspect of people's lives evidently, including people who have done nothing wrong. So pull up your underoos Sparky and act like a man.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jun 11, 2012 1:59 pm

You haven't challenged my beliefs as much as you have challenged your own preconceived notions of what liberals think and transferred them onto me or other members of this message board.

I have my own political opinions, which I choose to share with people who are somewhat like minded rather than try and show other people how wrong they are, which is what you're doing. I think you can understand the difference here.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:12 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:I have my own political opinions, which I choose to share with people who are somewhat like minded rather than try and show other people how wrong they are, which is what you're doing. I think you can understand the difference here.


I understand that you're annoyed that your circle jerk has been interrupted and you want to go back to those good ol' days. Boo hoo hoo. What kind of man would tell you that Santa isn't real? Ruined all your fun. Bad bad man. Stranger danger!

Time to grow up jonny. Your unicorns and rainbows aren't going to last your entire lifetime. Put aside the passive-aggressive behavior and learned helplessness and take some tiny steps into the real world.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:15 pm

jonnygothispen wrote: rather than try and show other people how wrong they are


Nevertheless you have written endless posts on many topics doing exactly that. Are you simply lacking self-awareness, or merely hypocritical?
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:29 pm

^ :)
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:35 pm

Dangerousman wrote:Nevertheless you have written endless posts on many topics doing exactly that. Are you simply lacking self-awareness, or merely hypocritical?


It wasn't meant as an exclusive "or." You're allowed to choose both.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:46 pm

Is that the 5th or 6th straw man? Endless,hey?

I'm not on a conservative message board telling people how wrong they are.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:06 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:Endless,hey?



Yes, you don't know when to STFU.

Is this a liberal message board? It's not labeled as such. I think it's called "The Daily Page." Oh.... I get it... "daily page"... almost sounds like "The Daily Worker." Duh!!
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby Dangerousman » Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:07 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:
I'm not on a conservative message board telling people how wrong they are.


I might be.
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Re: What I Learned on June 5th, 2012

Postby lukpac » Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:16 pm

Dangerousman wrote:Is this a liberal message board? It's not labeled as such. I think it's called "The Daily Page." Oh.... I get it... "daily page"... almost sounds like "The Daily Worker." Duh!!


de facto
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