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Obamacare Ruling for Adults

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Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Cornbread » Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:48 pm

Anyone else perplexed by the ruling? I only caught pieces of the presentation, but I do remember some leftists court justices trying to tell zerobam's lawyer it's not a tax.

And the only way it could pass was by defining it as a tax by roberts.
Yet it wasn't written into law as a tax because it wouldn't have gotten enough democrat votes for it to get to zerobam's desk.

Robert's comments about the people getting the government they vote for was interesting (or whatever it was he said).
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Cornbread » Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:38 am

The silence here is what's typical of the leftists when they are asked to discuss things they cannot cut and paste. Yes viewers, continue taking notes on the black hole of debate/discussion all around them.

What's amazing is that a supreme court justice changed what its funding mechanism is--from a "mandate" to a "tax" and once this was done, it then became constitutional (meaning, it passes the constitutional test and is 'law').

So does this make the judicial branch (appellate courts) just an extension of the legislative branch (congress) and/or the executive branch (white house)?

I think the leftists can't chime in because they can't figure out how to work in terms like "teabaggers" or the like into an actual, adult conversation. :lol:

Going to be very interesting come next election time. :D
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Stu Levitan » Sat Jun 30, 2012 9:43 am

Cornbread wrote:Anyone else perplexed by the ruling?


Not really. But since you are, I hope this help.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby wack wack » Sat Jun 30, 2012 9:48 am

First, I'm guessing the reason you get no response is that I'm about the only leftist here who doesn't have you on ignore.

There's no conversation to have: the USSC declared the Affordable Healthcare Act completely constitutional. That's the final word. The end. No need to explain anything.

The petulant response from the losers on the right has been absolutely delicious.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Comrade » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:04 pm

Honestly, I find the ruling to be deeply disturbing. While I agree with their interpretation of the mandate being illegal in terms of the interstate commerce clause, I find their notion that it is acceptable as a tax to be very troublesome.

This goes far beyond healthcare. The amendment to the constitution granting the power of taxation is clear. The avowed purpose of that was to be a funding mechanism for the government. However, we are now using that as a weapon to bludgeon citizens into behavior the government wants.

Not only is this an abuse of power, but also a very bad precedent. The government can now justify using taxes to control people. I firmly believe that is inappropriate in a free society that values and respects the liberty of the individual.

Both sides of the isle will build on this abuse in the years to come. To me, thursday was a very sad day. It was not with the price paid, to achieve this particular objective.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Stu Levitan » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:22 pm

"Taxes are what we pay for civilized society, including the chance to insure", Compania General De Tabacos De Filipinas v. Collector of Internal Revenue, 275 U.S. 87, 100, Holmes, J.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Comrade » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:34 pm

Stu, you missed the point entirely. Should taxes be used as a mechanism to control people? I sincerely believe that to be an abuse of power.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:06 pm

Comrade wrote: Should taxes be used as a mechanism to control people? I sincerely believe that to be an abuse of power.

Like the "sin" taxes on booze and tobacco?

Tax credits are also used as a mechanism to control people. Mortgage interest write-offs and other itemized deductions, for example.







"
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Comrade » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:29 pm

No sir! Not like that at all. You are now taxed for failing to do something. That is an entirely different situation then a tax credit. Nobody is making you buy a house and get a mortgage. This has now been taken to an entirely new level.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Bwis53 » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:37 pm

Do you have a better idea or should those who can't afford health insurance be free to die?
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby david cohen » Sat Jun 30, 2012 4:40 pm

I don't believe we are being "taxed" for failing to get an insurance policy. We are being "fined" for violating a federal law. It's akin to a traffic violation: driving too fast endangers your fellow citizens so you pay a fine if you get caught driving too fast. Not paying into the insurance pool endangers your fellow citizens as well- it raises their cost for insurance. Yeah, I know some uber-conservative SCOTUS Justice is calling it a tax, but he's the only one who interpreted it that way. It sure as hell isn't perfect, but then what else in life is perfect??
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Jun 30, 2012 5:13 pm

Honest question. If someone refuses the pay, what recourse does the government have to collect? I don't think it is part of the tax code.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Comrade » Sat Jun 30, 2012 6:01 pm

David, your assertion is incorrect. The court ruled that this is a tax. It is not a penalty.

Henry is wrong as usual. It is part of the code. It will be in your return and enforced by the IRS.

This was a very very foolish thing to do and will be abused by both conservatives and liberals for generations to come. Sadest part of all is that insuring the uninsured could have been done very simply and easily with no loss of freedom for anyone. All we had to do was increase Medicare to include them.
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Jun 30, 2012 6:26 pm

Comrade, you seem to know a lot about the penalty for not having health insurance. How does the IRS know if tax filers have coverage? What about people who don't need to file?
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Re: Obamacare Ruling for Adults

Postby bdog » Sat Jun 30, 2012 6:36 pm

Excellent questions Henry.

I looked around for a neutral site that explains how all this is going to work but have not been able to find one yet.
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