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Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

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Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Sun Jul 08, 2012 2:02 pm

A review suggests that legitimate votes that are rejected are far more numerous than cases of fraud.

As more states put in place strict voter ID rules, an AP review of temporary ballots from Indiana and Georgia, which first adopted the most stringent standards, found that more than 1,200 such votes were tossed during the 2008 general election.

During sparsely attended primaries this year in Georgia, Indiana and Tennessee, the states implementing the toughest laws, hundreds more ballots were blocked.

The numbers suggest that the legitimate votes rejected by the laws are far more numerous than are the cases of fraud that advocates of the rules say they are trying to prevent. Thousands more votes could be in jeopardy for this November, when more states with larger populations are looking to have similar rules in place.

More than two dozen states have some form of ID requirement, and 11 of those passed new rules over the past two years largely at the urging of Republicans who say they want to prevent fraud.

Democrats and voting rights groups fear that ID laws could suppress votes among people who may not typically have a driver's license, and disproportionately affect the elderly, poor and minorities. While the number of votes is a small percentage of the overall total, they have the potential to sway a close election. Remember that the 2000 presidential race was decided by a 537-vote margin in Florida.

A Republican leader in Pennsylvania said recently that the state's new ID law would allow Romney to win the state over President Barack Obama.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Cornbread » Sun Jul 08, 2012 6:30 pm

Very tough, hard, old school reporting.
"laws could...."

Was this from Conjecture News Network too? :D
When will the "news story" of "Elimination of Capital Gains tax and reduction if income tax to a flat 5% could save this nation from economic disaster"?
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby johnfajardohenry » Sun Jul 08, 2012 6:54 pm

If I lived in the upper 50 I probably would not even bother to register to vote. The voting systems in all states seem fatally flawed. Some worse than others but all to some degree.

You joke about "Vote early vote often", collecting ballots in cemetaries and such. Every election seems to be built around charges of fraud.

ID cards might help restore trust. The trust is so badly broken that it will take more than ID cards and it will take a while.

Here, in Puerto Rico, you not only need an ID card, you need a special ID card issued by the state elections commission that cannot be used for ID in anything other than voting. It has a number of anti-counterfeiting measures and is pretty secure. Probably moreso than most drivers licenses.

We routinely get turnouts of 70% and more. That is not 70% of registered voters, that is 70% of everyone over 18.

We have almost no absentee ballots, no electronic voting machines. We have paper ballots marked with pencil.

Polls are open for 4 hours on election Tuesday and if you miss the window, tough.

Uncertified election results are normally available by 8-9PM on election day for gov, lt gov, senators, reps, mayors, assemblymen. Certified results take a week or so more but seldom vary significantly from the election day results.

There is some early, though same day, voting for police, election workers and others. Absentee ballots are available for students and military and nobody else.

And we still get 70% turnout of everyone over 18.

I've been here for every election since 72, voted in most of them since 76. We almost never have any allegations of fraud. We have even fewer cases where it has been proven.

It just ain't that hard, folks. If we can do it, with our rather dysfunctional government, anyone can.

I fail to see the point of elections where you do not know who is voting and if they are eligible.

That ain't what democracy looks like.

John Henry
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby johnfajardohenry » Sun Jul 08, 2012 6:56 pm

One more comment:

We don't get any better class of pols than you do. Ours are just as crappy as any others, for the most part.

But at least we can have faith that they won their elections honestly.

John Henry
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Sun Jul 08, 2012 6:58 pm

Not just 'could', 'did':
The husband and wife, both approaching 90 years old, had to use a temporary ballot that would be verified later, even though they knew the people working the polling site that day. Unaware that Indiana law obligated them to follow up with the county election board, the Weidenbeners ultimately had their votes rejected — news to them until informed recently by an Associated Press reporter.

That would be leftists Edward and Mary Weidenbener. Ed is a veteran of the leftist WWII. He tried to vote for leftist Mitt Romney in the leftist Republican primary.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Sun Jul 08, 2012 7:22 pm

Where is that 'fraud' that Voter ID is supposed to solve?

It doesn't exist.
“Some 1,500 people voted under dead people’s and prisoners’ names from 2008-11, according to Michigan’s auditor general. Many might be clerical errors, but this illustrates the need to ensure accurate voter rolls.”

Michigan Secretary of State Ruth Johnson wrote this in a July 2 Times-Herald column, and she lied.

...
Despite Johnson’s constant refrain on dead people voting, her own Bureau of Elections has already established that there was no actual voter fraud in the auditor general’s report she referenced in her July 2 column.

Happily, Gov. Snyder isn't going along the with disenfranchisement scheme.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:08 am

Texas' voter ID law goes before federal court today

The trial before a panel of judges starts this morning in U.S. District Court in downtown Washington. In the lawsuit Texas v. Attorney General Eric Holder, the state asks the court to approve its law requiring that voters produce a government-issued photo card, and also asks the court to strike down a section of the Voting Rights Act that requires states with a history of voter discrimination to get approval for new voter plans. Student IDs are not accepted under the Texas law.

Texas is one of the states required under the Voting Rights Act to have new voting laws cleared in advance by the Justice Department. In March, the federal agency struck down the 2011 Texas law, saying that based on Texas' own data, more than 600,000 of the state's registered voters lack a driver's license or ID card issued by the state's Department of Public Safety and a disproportional amount are Latino, the Star-Telegram reports. The Justice Department also maintained that providing free state cards from the public safety agency was not enough because 81 of Texas' 254 counties don't have offices, according to the news agency.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby wack wack » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:34 am

johnfajardohenry wrote:Every election seems to be built around charges of fraud.

John Henry


Which are virtually never validated. This is a matter of sore losing, not voter fraud.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:59 pm

Henry Vilas
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Cornbread » Tue Jul 10, 2012 7:11 pm

DCB wrote:Not just 'could', 'did':


:lol: Had to go all the way to indiana to find two people that had to *gasp!* to cast a "provisional ballot"?

The horror, the horror....

Just check out racine with all the typical voting 'accidents' common with the democrat party. Not only is that more than two, but ya don't even have to do a national search to find something....
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Tue Jul 10, 2012 10:27 pm

Mother Jones covers the national issue:

UFO Sightings Are More Common Than Voter Fraud
While defending its precedent-setting photo ID law before the Supreme Court, Indiana was unable to cite a single instance of voter impersonation in its entire history.

But we do know of at least two citizens who were disenfranchised.

Closer to home?

Last December, Republican National Committee Chairman Reince Priebus declared that Wisconsin is "absolutely riddled with voter fraud." In fact, the state's voter fraud rate in 2004 was 0.0002 percent—just 7 votes.


If there were real problems with voting in Racine, I'm sure Van Hollen would have been all over it. Actual cases? as real as UFOs.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Dangerousman » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:47 pm

And then there's this Milwaukee Police Special Investigations Unit report on voter fraud in Milwaukee:

http://media2.620wtmj.com/breakingnews/ ... 474926.pdf
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Dangerousman » Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:02 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:"We call those poll taxes"


What a crock from Holder. There's your selective outrage for you.

If requiring an ID is discriminatory because of a disparate impact on minorities and elderly, then why isn't Holder fighting against the requirement to show ID when buying a firearm from a federally licensed dealer? Can't have it both ways, Holder: either it's having a discriminatory impact for both constitutionally protected activities, or for neither.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby pjbogart » Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:13 pm

Hmmm. I wonder if being able to vote in a democracy is considered more sacrosanct than the right to own a firearm?

On the one hand we have people attempting to exercise the most fundamental right of democracy, on the other hand we have people who want to own devices which are adept at killing other people.

Let's see... if we're going to restrict access to one of these rights, should we make it the right to own guns or the right to vote?
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:23 pm

pjbogart wrote:Hmmm. I wonder if being able to vote in a democracy is considered more sacrosanct than the right to own a firearm?

On the one hand we have people attempting to exercise the most fundamental right of democracy, on the other hand we have people who want to own devices which are adept at killing other people.

Let's see... if we're going to restrict access to one of these rights, should we make it the right to own guns or the right to vote?

Well, one of those is in the Bill of Rights. If fact, its really the only thing in the bill of rights that really matters.

The "right to vote" is just the product of activist judges.
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