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'Popular' economics!: AKA: "Destruction al la shorts"

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Re: 'Popular' economics!: AKA: "Destruction al la shorts"

Postby Mad Howler » Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:10 pm

Detritus wrote:Give us something to bounce off of. I think we get better conversations around here when the OP is not trying to be artificially neutral.


Okay, let me try this out here. I've been following Chris Hedges to some extent. Each time I check in I find his positions provocative and worryingly true. So I saw the piece below today and frankly kind of felt sick. I felt sick because I have witnessed and been part of the attitudes he eludes to and I am terrified by the historical consequences he lays out. I chose my moniker for a reason, I fear I may be doomed to barking at the moon. Regardless, it is clear to me that peace is tenuous a frame, and the divisions that cross friends, families, coworkers, forons, etc. in this state are probably terribly normal as well as terrifying.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/the ... _20120723/
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Re: 'Popular' economics!: AKA: "Destruction al la shorts"

Postby Detritus » Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:23 pm

OK, the banality of evil. Funny that he would even quote Hannah Arendt without mentioning that phrase--or maybe he did and I just missed it. I think it's worth remembering that evil on an organizational scale (Enron, the Holocaust, the US invasion of Iraq) may well be implemented by banal, well meaning people (Good Germans), but it is conceived, designed, and put into motion by truly evil people who are not in the least well meaning. I know there has been quite an effort to portray the Vietnam War, for example, as the US following a well meaning foreign policy, but carrying things out poorly. I think that view is a mistake: you can acknowledge that the average GI was doing what they had to while at the same time observing that the masterminds (McGeorge Bundy, Kissinger, Johnson, Nixon, etc.) were not being banal but purposeful. Whether they literally wanted to cause the deaths of thousands of people in Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos (not to mention the serious social and political damage they caused Thailand, the Philippines, Indonesia, and Burma) or simply didn't care as long as their political objectives were accomplished really doesn't matter.

Eichmann is not a good example of a Good German. He claimed to have been one, but history says otherwise.
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Re: 'Popular' economics!: AKA: "Destruction al la shorts"

Postby Mad Howler » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:31 pm

Thanks Detri,
I do not disagree with your frame. I have and want to be there myself. What is curious to me is how history has defined the "bad" players retrospectively in our collective minds. What is more interesting to me is calling BS real-time. Not necessarily an innovative notion but, perhaps, virtuous?
MH
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Re: 'Popular' economics!: AKA: "Destruction al la shorts"

Postby Detritus » Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:05 pm

Mad Howler wrote:Thanks Detri,
I do not disagree with your frame. I have and want to be there myself. What is curious to me is how history has defined the "bad" players retrospectively in our collective minds. What is more interesting to me is calling BS real-time. Not necessarily an innovative notion but, perhaps, virtuous?
MH

People do that all the time. The problem is that unless you have complete information, it's easy to call BS on something just because it doesn't fit into your vision of the world, rather than because it really is evil. Waiting to get a broader perspective can help with that....
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Re: 'Popular' economics!: AKA: "Destruction al la shorts"

Postby Mad Howler » Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:41 am

Detritus wrote: The problem is that unless you have complete information, it's easy to call BS on something just because it doesn't fit into your vision of the world, rather than because it really is evil. Waiting to get a broader perspective can help with that....


Man! I can't agree with you more. I have spent a good deal of time broading my perspective an have come to find good old fashion evil alive and well. Now, I never expect it to be absent but I find our collective tolerance at its present level disturbing.
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