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Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Tue Aug 21, 2012 9:49 am

The real voter fraud is the disenfranchisement of hundreds of thousands of otherwise eligible voters throughout the country because of unnecessary ID restrictions. Period.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Fri Aug 24, 2012 5:15 pm

In Pennsylvania:

In only 13% of observations was there signage in the reception area indicating a voter ID could be obtained. In almost half the visits, neither signs nor written information was observed.
While most PennDOT staff encountered by our volunteers were familiar with the request for voter ID, in nearly half the visits individuals were given incomplete or inaccurate information.
Few PennDOT staff volunteered that a voter ID could be acquired for free, and in three in 10 cases, volunteers were told incorrectly that they would have to pay.
The standard form for obtaining a non-photo ID does not indicate that it is available for free to certain voters, and a second form required to get the ID was not readily available.
The number and hours of operation of PennDOT offices are quite limited. There are 71 driver’s license centers in all of Pennsylvania, and nine counties do not have any centers at all. In an additional 20 counties, the driver’s license center is open three days a week or less.
One in five volunteers had to return a second time because the Driver License center or Photo License center was closed.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Aug 24, 2012 5:48 pm

Our own AG states that obtaining a state issued ID is not onerous.

Attorney General argues voter ID not a burden
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:05 pm

True the Vote group intimidates voters, all in the name of preventing voter fraud.

Two of the observers were from a Houston-based group called True the Vote, an offshoot of the Houston tea party known as the King Street Patriots. Their stated goal is to prevent voter fraud, which the group and founder Catherine Engelbrecht claims is undermining free and fair elections.
...
Voting rights groups say white poll watchers in minority areas can have a disenfranchising impact even if there’s no direct interaction, and as a result the debate has unfolded largely in a racial and partisan context.

Why are the observers targeting voting precincts with large minority populations?
This poll might shed some light on their tactics.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:26 pm

Florida passed some of most egregious voter suppression laws:
A federal judge on Wednesday said he was prepared to grant a permanent injunction that would block controversial restrictions on voter registration groups passed by Florida Gov. Rick Scott (R) last year.
...
The Florida Times-Union reported earlier this week that voter registration groups had largely shut down their operations in the wake of the new strictures, a trend that has done serious damage to registration trends of Democratic voters.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Aug 30, 2012 1:27 pm

Federal court strikes down Texas voter ID law

A federal appeals court in Washington Thursday struck down the Texas voter ID law requiring photos for voters at the polls, calling it racially discriminatory.

South Carolina is next.

Too bad the federal Voters Rights Act only applies to the old Confederacy and not to states like Wisconsin and Pennsylvania.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Sep 01, 2012 12:14 pm

Ohio ordered to restore weekend early voting in judge’s ruling

Another attempt to suppress the vote overturned by a federal court.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby johnfajardohenry » Mon Sep 03, 2012 8:18 pm

Oh the horror!

"Please complete the following form regarding your organization’s primary contact information and the authorized designee(s) to whom your 2012 Democratic National Convention credentials can be issued.

All pickup persons must have a state-issued ID that matches the name submitted below.(emph added-JRH)

http://www.demconvention.com/official-p ... tribution/

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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby johnfajardohenry » Mon Sep 03, 2012 8:20 pm

And there is this:

A Raleigh-based group devoted to reducing the potential for voter fraud presented the N.C. Board of Elections on Friday with a list of nearly 30,000 names of dead people statewide who are still registered to vote.

Read more here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/0 ... rylink=cpy

What is the point in even registering if one can't trust the voting process to be fair?

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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby rabble » Mon Sep 03, 2012 8:24 pm

And we all know, if dead people are still on the rolls, they must be voting, because we don't keep records of who voted. So if thousands of dead people voted, we'd have no way to tell. Oh, the horror!

Oh, wait.

Hey, how's that electronic voting machine thing going?
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby DCB » Mon Sep 03, 2012 8:52 pm

The Voter Integrity Project describes itself as a nonpartisan group aimed at clean, fair elections....
Earlier this summer, the organization sued to have 528 Wake County residents it claimed were not U.S. citizens removed from the voter registration. The county elections board investigated the complaint and found that all of the voters were citizens and eligible to vote.

A real sharp outfit they got there.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby johnfajardohenry » Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:52 am

rabble wrote:Hey, how's that electronic voting machine thing going?


Do you really want to get me started on that?

For the record, I am against them and would not vote in any election where they are used.

I am pretty old school on voting. Paper ballots, marked by hand on the day of election. Counted by hand.

No machines of any kind. Pretty much no absentee or early voting. If you want to vote, show up at the polls on election day.

With a voter ID card.

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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby Galoot » Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:12 pm

No absentee voting? Holy cow. You've already demonstrated your lunacy by citing whackjob extremist websites as your sources, John Henry, but this takes the cake.

On what basis do you justify removing the constitutional right of our soldiers around the world to vote? I live in Brazil, but I'm a U.S. citizen, and I have the right to vote according to the U.S. Constitution. But according to John Falardo Henry, that just won't do, my vote has to be taken away just because I don't happen to be in the United States (and territories) on election day.

Here's a big fuck you, you fascist.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby rabble » Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:40 pm

johnfajardohenry wrote:
rabble wrote:Hey, how's that electronic voting machine thing going?


Do you really want to get me started on that?

No, that was just an aftersnark.

What I really want to get you started on is how you equate dead people still on the rolls with dead people voting.

Since we keep records on dead people, and records of who can vote, and records of who voted, how many of those thousands of dead people have been caught voting? Why aren't you complaining about those? The numbers are right there for everyone to see.

THAT'S what I want to get you started on. I shouldn't have put two separate points in that post. It distracted you.
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Re: Tough ID laws could block thousands of 2012 votes

Postby johnfajardohenry » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:35 pm

Galoot wrote:
On what basis do you justify removing the constitutional right of our soldiers around the world to vote?


Really? I said that?

What I actually said was:

"Pretty much no absentee or early voting. If you want to vote, show up at the polls on election day."

Not no absentee voting. Just pretty much no or very limited absentee voting.

We have that policy here and it works pretty well. The only ones who can vote absentee, as a group, are military serving outside PR and students studying outside PR. I am fine with that. Others can, in theory, get absentee ballots on a case by case basis but in practice it is difficult.

I looked into it couple elections ago when I was going to be in Chicago on election day. I wound up not even trying. Maybe I should have voted in Chicago. They don't seem too fussy who votes.

As for early voting, we do have some provisions for early voting by police, election workers, medical personnel and others who need to be working during the election. But early voting in this case is about 12 hours before regular voting. There are also special provisions made for those incarcerated (we let our felons vote), hospitalized or otherwise unable to get to the polls.

It works out very well for us. We have very high registration and turnout and, in the 40 years I have been here not even jokes about election fraud.

Galoot wrote: I live in Brazil, but I'm a U.S. citizen, and I have the right to vote according to the U.S. Constitution.


really? You cast a US federal ballot?

Not a state ballot?

How does that work? Can I get in on that?

All of your voting rights come from whatever state you are citizen/resident of, not from the federal government.

Our citizenship status here in PR is the same as yours (I assume you were born in the US). It is identical to anyone born in the upper 50. So where do we go to vote for President?

Every 5-10 years someone takes a case to the Federal courts demanding their "right" to vote. Every time the case is thrown out. There is no federal right to vote, only state rights.

"The constitutional claim is readily answered. Voting for President and Vice President of the United States is governed neither by rhetoric nor intuitive values but by a provision of the Constitution. This provision does not confer the franchise on "U.S. citizens" but on "Electors" who are to be "appoint[ed]" by each "State," in "such Manner" as the state legislature may direct, equal to the number of Senators and Representatives to whom the state is entitled. U.S. Const. art. II, § 1, cl. 2; see also id. amend. XII. (emph added-JRH)

<snip>

That the franchise for choosing electors is confined to "states" cannot be "unconstitutional" because it is what the Constitution itself provides. Hence it does no good to stress how important is "the right to vote" for President.



http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F ... -2186.html

If I live in one of the 50 states, I get voting rights as a citizen of that state. If I move out of the state temporarily, I can generally keep my state voting rights. If I move out permanently, I lose my state voting rights. (Your mileage may vary state to state but I believe the above is generally true)

You say you live in Brazil. Is that a temporary thing? Do you plan to come back to the US anytime soon? If not, I would say that by not being a resident and citizen of (your voting state name here) you are committing moral, if not legal fraud.

I was stationed in PR in 72 and voted a Virginia absentee ballot (McGovern). As soon as I switched my legal residence to PR, I had to give up my Virginia voting rights.

Galoot wrote:But according to John Falardo Henry, that just won't do, my vote has to be taken away just because I don't happen to be in the United States (and territories) on election day.


Actually, if you are a resident/citizen of one of the territories (or PR) you don't get to vote in any federal elections either.

Read the Constitution. Here is a link:

http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

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