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No child let ahead

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

No child let ahead

Postby johnfajardohenry » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:52 am

"François Hollande has a bold new plan to tackle social injustice and inequality in France: ban homework. Introducing his proposals for education reform last week at the Sorbonne, the French president declared that work "must be done in the [school] facility rather than in the home if we want to support the children and re-establish equality." "
<Snip>

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000087 ... TTopBucket

What will these geniuses think of next? Liberte, egalite, stupidite?

Perhaps cut the school day to 1 hour? That should really improve the quality of education. It will go a long way to making everyone equally ignorant.

I know that in some states and/or school districts there is a move to reduce homework. One more way our genius educators are failing us. I don't think they have managed to accomplish it yet.

My kids school felt that 3 hours/day was about the right amount of homework. Starting in 1st grade. My granddaughter (3rd grade) routinely spends 2-3 hours on HW.

Seems about right to me.

Please, Lord, spare us from educators.

John Henry
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby Henry Vilas » Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:55 am

johnfajardohenry wrote:Please, Lord, spare us from educators.

Thought you said your wife is a teacher.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby johnfajardohenry » Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:28 am

Henry Vilas wrote:
johnfajardohenry wrote:Please, Lord, spare us from educators.

Thought you said your wife is a teacher.


She is. She is a classroom teacher (history, civics and a couple of other related subjects over the years). Has been all her professional life. She has no input on policy.

I used the term "educator" in the sense of the geniuses who develop educational policies, this year's new ideas (every year) on teaching, homework, testing, curriculum and so on.

When teachers call themselves "educators" it seems pretentious to me. Teaching is an honorable profession. No need to tart it up with fancy sounding titles. Calling a teacher an educator is kind of like calling a trashman a sanitation engineer or a reporter a journalist.

My wife also has the advantage over most teachers in the upper 50 in how she was educated. She was never subjected to an education school, college, department or program. In PR, in her day, teacher knowledge was considered important. She has a regular history/political science BA from the UPR history dept. She took a couple of courses in how to get around in a classroom and then did practice teaching for a bit before being licensed.

Not being an "educator", she doesn't realize how horrible homework is. She assigns a lot of it. She used to complain to their teachers that our kids were not being given enough.

John Henry
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby Ducatista » Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:32 am

johnfajardohenry wrote:...the upper 50...

Also known as the only 50.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby johnfajardohenry » Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:42 am

Ducatista wrote:
johnfajardohenry wrote:...the upper 50...

Also known as the only 50.


I use that term to distinguish the 50 states from Puerto Rico as we are all "The United States"

The "Free Associated State" of Puerto Rico is also defined as a "state" for the purpose of most federal laws and regulations. Sometimes implicitly, often explicitly.

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Re: No child let ahead

Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:47 am

Except that residents Puerto Rico cannot vote in federal elections and most do not have pay federal income taxes.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby jman111 » Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:38 pm

johnfajardohenry wrote:When teachers call themselves "educators" it seems pretentious to me. Teaching is an honorable profession. No need to tart it up with fancy sounding titles. Calling a teacher an educator is kind of like calling a trashman a sanitation engineer or a reporter a journalist.

Or like calling an efficiency consultant a wizard?
Sorry, I meant "The Wizard".
johnfajardohenry wrote:I am "The Changeover Wizard"

(Note the definite article and caps)

John Henry
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby Mean Scenester » Thu Oct 18, 2012 2:32 pm

johnfajardohenry wrote:I use that term to distinguish the 50 states from Puerto Rico as we are all "The United States"

The "Free Associated State" of Puerto Rico is also defined as a "state" for the purpose of most federal laws and regulations. Sometimes implicitly, often explicitly.

Horseshit. Commonwealth, dude.

And if you think for a minute that it is the universal sentiment among the island's residents that "we are all The United States" then clearly you don't get out much. Frankly, I suspect you live somewhere in bumfuck Kentucky.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby WestSideYuppie » Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:59 pm

I have two kids in Madison schools, and have mixed views about homework. Some of the measures mentioned in that article were not so much about banning homework, as they were about moving similar work into a longer school day. And I think the article suggested a sentiment that the school could provide a better learning environment for some kids than their own homes.

In my own observation, homework is affected by a quantity-versus-quality tradeoff. At the K-5 level, the teachers who send the most work home are not the strongest teachers, and they may be using homework as a substitute for their own mastery of subjects like math, or for their ability to manage the classroom.

And a lot of the homework was just a waste: Inane worksheets, and endless drill work on skills that my kids have already mastered. One worksheet involved coloring a bunch of pictures. I asked my daughter what subject it was for, and she said: Science.

Middle school homework tends to be more substantive. Some homework is great. One of my kids went from hating math to loving it, when she got a teacher who presents math as an organized, methodical subject with challenging homework.

What would my kids do without homework? They would practice their music lessons, run around outside, read, annoy their parents, and so forth. I'm not against homework, but I think that the assignments have to be justified relative to the activities that they displace.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby johnfajardohenry » Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:54 pm

Mean Scenester wrote:[
Horseshit. Commonwealth, dude.

And if you think for a minute that it is the universal sentiment among the island's residents that "we are all The United States" then clearly you don't get out much. Frankly, I suspect you live somewhere in bumfuck Kentucky.


And your knowledge of the "Estado Libre Associado" (See our Constitution) comes from where?

As for how many want association of some kind with the US, including US citizenship, we have quasi-referenda on this every 4 years with more formal referenda periodically.

I say every 4 years because our 3 political parties are basically identified by their stance on status.

New Progressive Party (NPP) is statehood. They often call themselves "Estadistas".

Popular Democratic Party (PDP) with commonwealth. They call themselves "Estadolibrististas"

Puerto Rican Independence party (PIP) with Independence.

The PIP, and other even smaller independence parties are always down around 5% total.

The balance is divided more or less evenly between the other 2 parties.

Been like this for 40-50 years.

So before you start lecturing me on Puerto Rico politics, I suggest you get yourself a bit of knowledge.

John Henry
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby johnfajardohenry » Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:06 pm

WestSideYuppie wrote:And a lot of the homework was just a waste: Inane worksheets, and endless drill work on skills that my kids have already mastered.


Yes, the homework has to be useful. I figured that went without saying. Not just given for the sake of giving it. I have no real problem with repetitive drill for things like spelling, math and other subjects. Practice is how you learn. More practice is how you learn better.

My kids, would get some useless assignments and once a quarter, on parent teacher night, I would let the teacher know that I thought the homework was useless.

I would also, to my kids' consternation, let teachers know that I appreciated useful homework. For the most part, it was useful. Even if some of it might be characterized as drill.

What would my kids do without homework? They would practice their music lessons, run around outside, read, annoy their parents, and so forth.

Pretty much what my kids did. Son very active in sports, my daughter in choir and singing and so on.

After they had done their homework.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby massimo » Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:44 pm

johnfajardohenry wrote:Popular Democratic Party (PDP) with commonwealth. They call themselves "Estadolibrististas"


So I guess wikipedia works out in bumfuck KY, huh?

Actually, no, I'm not here to bust your balls, I was just trying to educate/teach myself about some PR politics, but could not locate this term. Zero google hits, even when I scramble some letters around. Is wiki wrong when it says they're commonly referred to as "populares"?
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby kurt_w » Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:50 pm

johnfajardohenry wrote:My kids school felt that 3 hours/day was about the right amount of homework. Starting in 1st grade. My granddaughter (3rd grade) routinely spends 2-3 hours on HW.

Seems about right to me.


I can guarantee that every parent I know would run screaming after reading this.

Kids that young (six or seven years old) really ought to have around 11 hours of sleep. Add 8 hours of school (a conservative estimate, from leaving home until returning home). Add in your absurd 3 hours of homework, and we're up to 22 hours. Now add in the time needed to wake up, get dressed, grab breakfast, pack their lunch; and, at the other end of the day, to eat dinner, help clean up, have a bath/shower, and get ready for bed.

Yeah, I guess you could, technically, fit it in. As long as you didn't mind that your kid had not one minute for anything beyond sleeping, eating, going to school, and doing homework.

That's ridiculous. No family should have to live like that.

First graders shouldn't have homework, period. They should come home from school and play outside, read a book, help their parents with chores, go to soccer practice, eat a snack, practice the piano, draw a picture, or just have some quiet time to do nothing in particular except mentally unwind from school.

Schools really shouldn't introduce routine homework until 3rd/4th grade, at the earliest, and it shouldn't be more than an hour a night until high school.
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby Donald » Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:10 pm

Along this line, I've heard of a few educators "flipping" the classroom, and was wondering what educators/parents think of this. Is it just another fad or gimmick, or is it worth trying? The idea is the students get the lesson by watching a video at home, then at school they apply the lessons learned. This explains it in more detail:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9aGuLuipTwg
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Re: No child let ahead

Postby Mean Scenester » Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:54 pm

johnfajardohenry wrote:So before you start lecturing me on Puerto Rico politics, I suggest you get yourself a bit of knowledge.

I suggest you go fuck yourself, blowhard Kentucky boy.

Puerto Rico is a commonwealth, not a state. And you're a jackass who can suck it.

Buh-bye ...
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