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Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby kurt_w » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:19 pm

Meade wrote:First of all, my home is not a gun-free zone.


Congratulations, I guess. Or not. That approximately doubles the chances that someone in your household will be the victim of a homicide, and increases the chance of suicide somewhere from 2x to 10x.

Source
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby wack wack » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:38 pm

Now the bad guys with guns know to shoot first when they get to Meade's house.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:32 pm

Notice he didn't say he owes guns, but that his home is not a "gun free zone." Maybe he just means that his buddies can come over while armed.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Detritus » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:04 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Notice he didn't say he owes guns, but that his home is not a "gun free zone." Maybe he just means that his buddies can come over while armed.

If he does own a gun, I hope he shoots better with that than he does with a video camera.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:13 pm

Detritus wrote:
Henry Vilas wrote:Notice he didn't say he owes guns, but that his home is not a "gun free zone." Maybe he just means that his buddies can come over while armed.

If he does own a gun, I hope he shoots better with that than he does with a video camera.
ZING!
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby rrnate » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:43 pm

Ah shoot, I was hoping to chime in with a "if he shoots his gun off like he shoots his mouth off, accuracy ain't in the cards" but now my joke is RUINED.

Oh well, Meade, you're an ignorant turd. Thanks for continuing to out yourself.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Detritus » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:03 pm

rrnate wrote:Ah shoot, I was hoping to chime in with a "if he shoots his gun off like he shoots his mouth off, accuracy ain't in the cards" but now my joke is RUINED.

Don't mourn--reload!

Or something.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby jonnygothispen » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:14 pm

Francis Di Domizio wrote:
jonnygothispen wrote:Say whatever you want about it, but there can't be a single person in this thread who would wish for an officer with Mr. Heimsness mind-set to have answered, or to answer the call if it was them, or one of their friends or family who had so much to drink that they didn't know what they were doing.



Would you be referring to Heimsness's mindset when he responded to a burglary in progress, when he saw the suspected burglar attacking the homeowner, or when the suspected burglar charged him?

Since the person attacking him had a recent history of violence, wouldn't that have affected Heimsness's mindset?

While you are thinking about it, since you seem to know what everyone thinks, do you believe there is a single person in this thread who would want one of their friends or relatives to drink so much that they don't know what they are doing? Do you think there is a single person in this thread that would want a loved one killed because they didn't defend themselves from a random attacker?
I'm referring to Heimsness' inability to adapt to a situation that wasn't what he was first told it was.
1. He easily separated from Pauli.
2. Heimsness inability to accurately assess Pauli's drunken state despite how ineffective Pauli was in their brief confrontation
3. Pauli was standing there with his hands at his side.
4. The neighbor yelled several times "He's my neighbor! He's my neighbor!" and if the reports are true, also said or may have said, "Don't shoot! He's not a burglar!

You can ignore the facts until you turn blue in the face if it makes you feel better.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby jonnygothispen » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:16 pm

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:
jonnygothispen wrote:there can't be a single person in this thread...


Well, that settles that then.
'Cuz if there's one thing I've learned from my time on TDPF, it's that jonny speaks for us all.
Just operating under the idea that no one would be happy about being killed or having their friends or family killed who were too drunk to understand what they were doing. I guess I was wrong about that. I'm sorry for making that assumption.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Stebben84 » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:26 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:Just operating under the idea that no one would be happy about being killed or having their friends or family killed who were too drunk to understand what they were doing.


Are you even reading what you write? Think about it. Using "too drunk to understand what they're doing" is a horrible excuse.

Maybe anyone who is entering someone else's home should use the excuse; guilty or not. Hey I was drunk. I have no idea why I have their money.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby jonnygothispen » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:30 pm

Not yelling "POLICE!" and not alerting the subject while making the claim that part of your actions resulted because it was too dark, then not hearing someone yelling at you before you engaged, and not choosing an alternative method besides shooting the guy while he stood there hands at his side, or not noticing another officer pull up (which I think is excusable considering that it allegedly occurred while they struggled) are horrible excuses. The difference is that that this lack of ability resulted in someone's death. Regardless of how cool Steve Heimsness is, this really has to be looked at more closely.

I watched the Schabow/Heimsness interview. He looks like a really, really nice guy, but something went horribly wrong.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:30 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:1. He easily separated from Pauli.

Please cite evidence of that?
jonnygothispen wrote:2. Heimsness inability to accurately assess Pauli's drunken state despite how ineffective Pauli was in their brief confrontation

Sure, in a very short amount of time, while being attacked, and trying to determine if his life was in danger, he didn't squeeze in a field sobriety test. A violent person and a drunk person can look a lot alike when the drunk person is attacking you.
jonnygothispen wrote:3. Pauli was standing there with his hands at his side.

Again, do you have any evidence of that? Have you even read the police report with O'Malley's statement or the statements of either of the officers who were present? Let me guess; "no because police lie"
jonnygothispen wrote:4. The neighbor yelled several times "He's my neighbor! He's my neighbor!" and if the reports are true, also said or may have said, "Don't shoot! He's not a burglar!

The first part of this has been address multiple times but
jonnygothispen wrote:You can ignore the facts until you turn blue in the face if it makes you feel better.

as to the second part, again please cite your evidence. You've clearly investigated this incident far better than the Department of Justice, the MPD, the County Sheriff, or the District Attorney's Office so why aren't you sharing all these "facts" you've dug up?
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:32 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:something went horribly wrong.


No shit Sherlock!
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby oranger » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:08 pm

"Right before he was shot his hands were at his sides," O'Malley said. "When he was shot his hands were at his chest, in a defensive position."

http://www.thedailypage.com/daily/artic ... icle=38695

At this point, when the two neighbors were on the sidewalk between their two homes, Officer Heimsness arrived on the scene, gun drawn. Heimsness yelled "Get down! Get down!" O'Malley said he and Heenan let go of each other, and Heenan kept walking toward the officer.

"That's when I started yelling, 'He's a neighbor!, he's a neighbor!" O'Malley said.

Heenan was drunkenly "flailing and swatting at the officer," said O'Malley, but he never saw him try to grab Heimsness' gun. Nor did he see Heimsness push Heenan away, as claimed, but concedes this could have occurred.
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Re: Officer won't face criminal liability in shooting death

Postby Meade » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:55 pm

kurt_w wrote:increases the chance of suicide somewhere from 2x to 10x.

2x 0 = 0
10x 0 = 0

Source: any 3rd grade arithmetic textbook
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