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Star Trek Into Mediocrity

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Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby uwstudent » Tue Jul 09, 2013 3:01 pm

Total rehash of Wrath of Khan, which is STILL a much better movie. And the bad guy is Khan BTW. They even copied whole lines of dialoge from the other movie. Sheesh.
Don’t they do anything ORIGINAL anymore?
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby fisticuffs » Tue Jul 09, 2013 3:06 pm

uwstudent wrote:Don’t they do anything ORIGINAL anymore?


No. Where have you been?
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:29 pm

uwstudent wrote:And the bad guy is Khan BTW.
True, this movie's been out for a while now, but you really should have marked this as a spoiler. I saw it a few weeks after release and had managed to read nothing about it, so although I figured it out before the reveal, I did not realize going in that this was the case, which was nice.

uwstudent wrote:They even copied whole lines of dialoge from the other movie. Sheesh.
It's called homage and I don't necessarily have a problem with it.
That said, I don't think the movie was any great shakes, and Wrath Of Khan definitely still has no contenders for greatest-ever Trek movie. (The first re-boot was definitely superior to this follow-up, but it still wasn't better than Khan.)

Some spoilers follow:
On the pro-side of this movie, I really do like most of the new cast. Kirk and Spock really shine in this film, and Cumberbatch was fantastic in an underwritten role. On the con-side (or should I say "Khan-side". No... no I shouldn't. Sorry.) except for Kirk and Spock there's exactly zero character depth to speak of this go-round, and Scotty and Uhuru, in particular, were mostly wasted (I guess every role was underwritten, especially Miss Marcus, who served no purpose whatsoever except to take her clothes off.)
The rehashing of Khan didn't bother me too much as the timeline altering of the first Trek makes such re-examination both possible and kinda fun (and there were some other nice bits of trivial Trek-lore scattered throughout for fans, like the use of DS9's Section 31) but there were three moments in particular that rang especially hollow for me:
1) I liked the idea of the Spock/Kirk reversal for the scene inside the reactor, but how it played out was decidedly lame. Whereas in Khan, Spock used his wits and skill to save the day, in this one, Kirk used brute force to solve their problem, literally kicking the ship until it worked. That's pretty stupid (not to mention out-of-character for Kirk, who used to outmaneuver computers with his brains, not kick them until they did what he wanted.) Not even Fonzie cool.
2) There was absolutely no drama to the scene, since there was no way in hell that Kirk was going to die. In Khan, Spock's death was unexpected and poignant, and there was no reason to believe that Spock would ever be returning. It could well have been the last Trek film and even if it wasn't, there was always the possibility of doing another without Nimoy. Not so with Kirk's death this go-round. Apart from the fact that I already know everyone is signed on for a third movie, they telegraphed that someone was going to come back from the dead with the earlier tribble scene. (I did like seeing the tribble, though.)
3) Spock's "Khaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan!!!!!!!" was obviously conceived to appeal to fans of the original, but it made no sense! Khan wasn't responsible for their predicament, Admiral Robocop was. He should have been yelling, "Maaaaaarrrrrrrcuuuuuussss!!!"

Overall, the movie was a fun-enough ride for a summer blockbuster, but not Avengers-awesome by any stretch.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Twofer4 » Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:39 pm

uwstudent wrote:Total rehash of Wrath of Khan, which is STILL a much better movie. And the bad guy is Khan BTW. They even copied whole lines of dialoge from the other movie. Sheesh.
Don’t they do anything ORIGINAL anymore?



Edit the thread title too warn of your SPOILER, you sniveling shit-stain.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Kenneth Burns » Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:53 pm

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:Whereas in Khan, Spock used his wits and skill to save the day, in this one, Kirk used brute force to solve their problem, literally kicking the ship until it worked.

To me this actually seemed sort of true to Trek, true to those Trek episodes that are wrapped up when characters devise a totally arbitrary technical solution to a totally arbitrary technical problem. All that was missing was a bit of crawling around in the Jefferies tube.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Bwis53 » Tue Jul 09, 2013 4:59 pm

I'm a generous critic. My BF and I enjoyed it. To me it looks like in each movie the characters are slowly being fleshed out and evolving. I especially enjoyed Scotty's bit. I also like how the father of the dying girl was motivated. (But who could ever top Ricardo Montalban?)
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Tue Jul 09, 2013 5:01 pm

Kenneth Burns wrote:
Prof. Wagstaff wrote:Whereas in Khan, Spock used his wits and skill to save the day, in this one, Kirk used brute force to solve their problem, literally kicking the ship until it worked.

To me this actually seemed sort of true to Trek, true to those Trek episodes that are wrapped up when characters devise a totally arbitrary technical solution to a totally arbitrary technical problem. All that was missing was a bit of crawling around in the Jefferies tube.

I dunno. To me, there's a difference betwen solving a problem with technobabble and just punching a problem away, but obviously, YMMV.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Kenneth Burns » Tue Jul 09, 2013 5:25 pm

The best moment of all Star Trek is in that animated series episode when ***SPOILERS*** Uhura commands the Enterprise.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby Mad Howler » Wed Jul 10, 2013 11:13 pm

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:
uwstudent wrote:And the bad guy is Khan BTW.
True, this movie's been out for a while now, but you really should have marked this as a spoiler. I saw it a few weeks after release and had managed to read nothing about it, so although I figured it out before the reveal, I did not realize going in that this was the case, which was nice.

uwstudent wrote:They even copied whole lines of dialoge from the other movie. Sheesh.
It's called homage and I don't necessarily have a problem with it.
That said, I don't think the movie was any great shakes, and Wrath Of Khan definitely still has no contenders for greatest-ever Trek movie. (The first re-boot was definitely superior to this follow-up, but it still wasn't better than Khan.)

Some spoilers follow:
On the pro-side of this movie, I really do like most of the new cast. Kirk and Spock really shine in this film, and Cumberbatch was fantastic in an underwritten role. On the con-side (or should I say "Khan-side". No... no I shouldn't. Sorry.) except for Kirk and Spock there's exactly zero character depth to speak of this go-round, and Scotty and Uhuru, in particular, were mostly wasted (I guess every role was underwritten, especially Miss Marcus, who served no purpose whatsoever except to take her clothes off.)
The rehashing of Khan didn't bother me too much as the timeline altering of the first Trek makes such re-examination both possible and kinda fun (and there were some other nice bits of trivial Trek-lore scattered throughout for fans, like the use of DS9's Section 31) but there were three moments in particular that rang especially hollow for me:
1) I liked the idea of the Spock/Kirk reversal for the scene inside the reactor, but how it played out was decidedly lame. Whereas in Khan, Spock used his wits and skill to save the day, in this one, Kirk used brute force to solve their problem, literally kicking the ship until it worked. That's pretty stupid (not to mention out-of-character for Kirk, who used to outmaneuver computers with his brains, not kick them until they did what he wanted.) Not even Fonzie cool.
2) There was absolutely no drama to the scene, since there was no way in hell that Kirk was going to die. In Khan, Spock's death was unexpected and poignant, and there was no reason to believe that Spock would ever be returning. It could well have been the last Trek film and even if it wasn't, there was always the possibility of doing another without Nimoy. Not so with Kirk's death this go-round. Apart from the fact that I already know everyone is signed on for a third movie, they telegraphed that someone was going to come back from the dead with the earlier tribble scene. (I did like seeing the tribble, though.)
3) Spock's "Khaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan!!!!!!!" was obviously conceived to appeal to fans of the original, but it made no sense! Khan wasn't responsible for their predicament, Admiral Robocop was. He should have been yelling, "Maaaaaarrrrrrrcuuuuuussss!!!"

Overall, the movie was a fun-enough ride for a summer blockbuster, but not Avengers-awesome by any stretch.


I really like this post.
I really did not want to see this movie, uw's comments and all.
Now I feel I should see it.
Damn you - Waaaaaaaagstaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaffffffffffff!
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby rabble » Thu Jul 11, 2013 9:46 am

Mad Howler wrote:I really did not want to see this movie, uw's comments and all.
Now I feel I should see it.

I, on the other hand, am extremely glad and grateful that we went to see it shortly after it came out because if I'd seen these spoilers I'd have waited till it was on TV.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby uwstudent » Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:47 pm

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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby rabble » Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:50 pm

That was funny.

I'm still glad I saw the movie before I saw this thread but that was really really funny.
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Re: Star Trek Into Mediocrity

Postby uwstudent » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:58 pm

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