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Penokee Hills

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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Donald » Thu Jul 11, 2013 9:25 pm

snoqueen wrote:So it becomes a matter of doing an end run around the government of the state of Wisconsin and going straight to the feds, just as we've had to with several other of Walker's laws.

Well, when it comes down to it, these are federal laws, and the state is allowed by the feds to take over permitting and enforcement as long as they do a decent job and follow the law. On another citizens' suit we filed, we got EPA to actually take over the state's Clean Water Act permitting on mining. It took the state a couple years to get it back by which time they were more than willing to listen to citizens. Pull their permitting and their money from EPA and they start taking their responsibility to citizens a little more seriously. By the way, it is never the professional staff who want to hide information. They know better. It's the political appointees/high ups, who basically have single digit IQs, and a penchant for licking corporate asses, since that's where they will be working next.

I would assume a lot of the info has to be disclosed to tribal governments, as well, and if it isn't I would think the tribes would be able to sue to shut them down totally.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby snoqueen » Fri Jul 12, 2013 8:10 am

By the way, it is never the professional staff who want to hide information. They know better. It's the political appointees/high ups....


Which is exactly why the governor wants to get rid of as many state employees (secure jobs) as possible and turn things over to independent contractors who work at his pleasure.

It's my understanding the tribes have very strong treaty rights, but the issue there is money. They aren't wealthy at all, they're very poor and not in a position to mount a big legal battle without lots of assistance from the concerned public.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby wack wack » Fri Jul 12, 2013 8:30 am

snoqueen wrote:The guy is a realtor.


I don't know what it is or was like growing up in Wisconsin, but when and where I grew up, "entrepreneurs" were losers who couldn't keep real jobs, and "realtors" were those who couldn't make it as "entrepreneurs."

Yes, I am sure there are intelligent, talented, professional, genuinely engaged real estate agents. But for them most part, it seems to be where people with few other options end up.

Real estate, high-risk finance, mercenary all say "shyster" to me. I would bet his empathy is very, very low... narcissistic, even.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Fri Jul 12, 2013 9:56 am

He's also an ex-cop. I'd be interested in how he got the "ex-" in ex-cop.

And found another reason Henry can get his hate on:
Bulletproof is aparently an active supporter of charter schools in Arizona

Not too shocking I guess since one of the services they provide is charter school security. Hopefuly without the masks and assault rifles.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Stebben84 » Fri Jul 12, 2013 9:58 am

Francis Di Domizio wrote:Not too shocking I guess since one of the services they provide is charter school security. Hopefuly without the masks and assault rifles.


They're good at camo, so maybe they can dress up as students and remain undetected.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Fri Jul 12, 2013 10:13 am

No. Really, I'm a student
images.jpg
images.jpg (6.83 KiB) Viewed 502 times
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby snoqueen » Fri Jul 12, 2013 3:28 pm

Read a complaint filed with the Iron County DA and a letter to the WI Dept of Safety and Professional Services (security licensing) by a Hurley attorney today:

http://woodsperson.blogspot.com/2013/07 ... state.html

The violations of Sec. 33.03 and 33.02 (regarding uniform requirements for security guards, beginning about halfway through the document) are the most compelling.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:13 pm

Interesting read. I'm curious what his goal is. Stopping Bulletproof from working isn't going to suddenly keep armed guards out of the Penokee Hills. Even big name companies such as G4S (Wackenhut) or Securitas are going to bring in armed guards if the customer requests it. And that's if GT decides to go with a more traditional provider. They could alway contract out to Academi.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Dipper » Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:53 pm

I don't know what it is or was like growing up in Wisconsin, but when and where I grew up, "entrepreneurs" were losers who couldn't keep real jobs, and "realtors" were those who couldn't make it as "entrepreneurs."

Yes, I am sure there are intelligent, talented, professional, genuinely engaged real estate agents. But for them most part, it seems to be where people with few other options end up.

Real estate, high-risk finance, mercenary all say "shyster" to me. I would bet his empathy is very, very low... narcissistic, even.


I agree that running a paramilitary security team while you're a realtor is unsettling, but there's no reason to imply that realtor = idiot. Plenty of people in rough spots have had to change careers. It doesn't mean they are stupid or evil.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby snoqueen » Fri Jul 12, 2013 5:17 pm

I'm curious what his goal is. Stopping Bulletproof from working isn't going to suddenly keep armed guards out of the Penokee Hills.


I'm guessing it's something like "hey, we still have laws around here and if you guys are going to work here, you need to be following them."

I doubt it'll make much difference in the long run. Gogebic is going to have security (and maybe make them wear proper uniforms instead of looking like they're in some video game) and most likely Bulletproof and its employees will get licensed, because from what I can tell they were cooperative once informed of their infractions.

I am thinking it was the first time the company ever worked out-of-state (Arizona) or outside the Southwest. That's what you get when you work with somebody who's either moonlighting as a realtor or moonlighting as a security operator.

I'm still trying to figure out where the ex in ex-cop comes from, but it's probably going to take a more experienced investigator than me, maybe somebody who's done collections and knows how to trace people.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Sat Jul 13, 2013 8:15 am

snoqueen wrote:I'm guessing it's something like "hey, we still have laws around here and if you guys are going to work here, you need to be following them."


They were already working to comply with the laws before he sent out his letters. He's either interested in stopping from working here period or doing a PR stunt. Outside of felony convictions the disciplinary actions are all at the discretion of the department, I'm guessing he wants Safety and Regulations to throw the book at them, and I suspect you are correct that it won't work.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby wack wack » Sat Jul 13, 2013 8:27 am

Dipper wrote:I agree that running a paramilitary security team while you're a realtor is unsettling, but there's no reason to imply that realtor = idiot. Plenty of people in rough spots have had to change careers. It doesn't mean they are stupid or evil.


I certainly wasn't referring to your real estate career, apologies for any offense. I understand there are many genuine, honest, good people selling real estate.

However, real estate, like any sales job, is attractive to those who lack empathy and desire money at any cost. He also worked in high risk finance and other endeavors which seem to appeal to those with little regard for their fellow man. It's not just real estate, but the picture as a whole which alarmed me.

Am I making assumptions? Sure. Could I be wrong about the gentleman from Arizona? Yes. Is it likely? Nope.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Dipper » Sat Jul 13, 2013 11:31 am

However, real estate, like any sales job, is attractive to those who lack empathy and desire money at any cost.


Wow, I had no idea my father was being such a heartless, ruthless bastard all his life. Are there any other professions that you care to cast into your pit of shame? This Bulletproof clown doesn't need to be tethered to your petty prejudices in order to be seen as a bad guy. Stick to the facts.
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby lukpac » Sat Jul 13, 2013 11:36 am

Dipper wrote:
However, real estate, like any sales job, is attractive to those who lack empathy and desire money at any cost.


Wow, I had no idea my father was being such a heartless, ruthless bastard all his life. Are there any other professions that you care to cast into your pit of shame? This Bulletproof clown doesn't need to be tethered to your petty prejudices in order to be seen as a bad guy. Stick to the facts.


Huh? wack^2 didn't say all salespeople lacked empathy, they said sales is attractive to those who lack empathy. You disagree?
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Re: Penokee Hills

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Sat Jul 13, 2013 11:38 am

Don't be a drama queen. He said it's attractive to that type, not that every one with a real estate career is a heartless, ruthless bastard.

Personally I still think his ex-cop status is more of an issue. Experience with ex-cops who went into security when they could no longer work as police officers makes me suspicious.
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