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"Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby snoqueen » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:10 pm

It's topics like this that bring the Forum together, folks. Let's all sing a chorus for swimmy.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby Huckleby » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:13 pm

I love Neil Young's song "Down by The River", which conflates a sweet love story with a murder.....

Be on my side,
I'll be on your side, baby
There is no reason
for you to hide
It's so hard for me
staying here all alone
When you could be
taking me for a ride.

Yeah, she could drag me
over the rainbow,
send me away
Down by the river
I shot my baby
Down by the river,
Dead, oh, shot her dead.

You take my hand,
I'll take your hand
Together we may get away
This much madness
is too much sorrow
It's impossible
to make it today.....

An afternoon of peace, love and celebration of murder?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jxs0ybnsEQ

The dark side touches people and oddly uplifts them. The blues, anal sex, "Breaking Bad" - none of this stuff is rational.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:17 pm

Then there are songs about stalking. From the Police, "Every Breath You Take" to Blonde's "One Way or Another."
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Sat Oct 19, 2013 1:31 pm

I completely agree that the lyrics are offensive. Heck, they're downright stupid. It's almost like it's a rock and roll song. Almost.
But I can't think of a single good reason to ban it.
I mean, if nothing else it's 42 years old! If it were going to cause any trouble, wouldn't we have noticed by now? It's not like "Helter Skelter". That song was trouble.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby scratch » Sat Oct 19, 2013 3:19 pm

Huckleby wrote:
Henry Vilas wrote:
When the Stones were on the Ed Sullivan Show, he had them sing "Let's Spend Some Time Together."


I think they sang the lyric correctly, then never got invited back on the show.


They sang it as Henry quoted it. Jagger looked squarely at the camera and rolled his eyes dramatically to register his resentment. And I don't think that was their last appearance on the Sullivan show though I easily could be wrong. It's been a long time.

IIRC Jefferson Airplane refused to alter the line "Tear down the walls motherfuckers" for the Dick Cavett show and simply didn't go on as scheduled. Cavett apologized profusely.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby snoqueen » Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:07 pm

Prof. Wagstaff wrote:I completely agree that the lyrics are offensive. Heck, they're downright stupid. It's almost like it's a rock and roll song. Almost.
But I can't think of a single good reason to ban it.
I mean, if nothing else it's 42 years old! If it were going to cause any trouble, wouldn't we have noticed by now? It's not like "Helter Skelter". That song was trouble.

Great argument against song-banning right there. If in those 42 years we can't point to a single instance where it's caused anybody to claim it made them try to act out the lyrics, isn't that a pretty good road test?


The idea art or culture should be only about pretty things is totally vapid. How do you feel about Soviet Neo-realism?
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby swimmingupstream » Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:30 pm

Maybe I should have written "retired." Like offensive sport teams mascots and Al Jolson style black face. At least you can argue that Jolson was celebrating African American culture unlike this ugly song by the Rolling Stones.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby swimmingupstream » Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:46 pm

This topic is bring back many funny memories of some of the crappy rock concerts that I was dragged to back in the day.

Another one I had to endure was when I was an under grad in Seattle back around 73. My then boyfriend at the time insisted I go see Bob Dylan with him and his friends who I absolutely loathed!

He insisted he was the poet of our generation. I think he was trying to impress me because I was an English lit major. I should have replied that Emily Dickinson was the poet of MY generation and every other generation.

Anyways the concert was really horrid. My boyfriend friends kept insisting that the backing band were great in their own right but when I would ask what the band's name was they would just laugh at me. They were completely drugged out of their minds. I refused to partake in such dangerous substance taking.

Dylan seemed really tired and/or lazy. Half the time during the show he would just let the no name back up band play alone! I thought at the time he must be really old but I just looked up his age and he was only in his early thirties. I guess he had stage fright or he was just lazy. Like Dylan nobody in the back up band could sing a song in tune. But that did not stop all of the drugged out hippies from cheering and completely eating it up! As they say, fools and their money...
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby Huckleby » Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:21 pm

I saw Dylan at the Dane County Colessium in the early 80's, went with very low expectations because I thought the guy was washed up. Just an amazing performance, he had the audience in the palm of his hands from start to finish, especially when he just accompanied himself on guitar. I've heard that his live performances are uneven.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby Average Joe » Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:58 pm

Dylan uses the N-word in "Hurricane". Is that offensive or artistic context? Are the other examples artistic context?
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby Igor » Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:51 pm

I'm not a big fan of "banning" stuff. But there are few things less consistent than people being offended by artists. For example, Snoop Dogg is never going to cause the uproar that Ted Nugent could.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby snoqueen » Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:20 pm

I've always thought "Down By The River," which is one of rock's all-time great classics, was about domestic abuse leading to murder down by the river. It's about anguish, remorse, drama, passion. What else is art for, if not to express the inexpressible? I've heard that song a thousand times but I still tune in and even sing along. It'll never be elevator music -- it's one of the timeless greats.

Stuff I don't even understand the words of means just as much to people in generations after my own. In a way, you can't go banning songs without understanding their context. If I don't get why people want to hear songs that sound gross and offensive to me but are liked by others, that's more my problem than a problem with the songs.
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby david cohen » Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:08 am

Hey look, a troll managed to squeeze 3 pages out of the forum. Seriously lady, you lost me when it came to the Grateful Dead Cornell 1977 and the hook was spat out when you went into your Dylan 1973 rant...since Dylan didnt tour in 1973 and if it was 1974, then your dissing of The Band....hmmmm.....Brown Sugar my ass!
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby swimmingupstream » Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:52 am

Mr. Cohen,

It could have been 1974, but late 1973 seems more right. I just remember it being really damp and cold. But any day in Seattle for a Bay Area girl would feel damp and cold! LOL!
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Re: "Brown Sugar" needs to be banned!

Postby swimmingupstream » Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:02 pm

david cohen wrote:...then your dissing of The Band....hmmmm.....Brown Sugar my ass!


I did not say they weren't competent musicians. They seemed to know what they were doing. Though it was hard to tell given how loud they played. I did say nobody on stage could sing in tune. As someone who takes music seriously, I find that bothersome.

Do you know the name of the band that played behind Bob Dylan in 1974? The group I saw in 1973 did not seem to have a name though everyone around me at the concert I saw said how great they were.
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