MOBILE USERS: m.isthmus.com
Connect with Isthmus on Twitter · Facebook · Flickr · Newsletters · Instagram 
Wednesday, July 30, 2014 |  Madison, WI: 74.0° F  A Few Clouds
Collapse Photo Bar

Christie lied, a woman died

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.

Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Stu Levitan » Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:47 pm

91-year-old woman died because Chris Christie's staff took political revenge on constituents of Democratic mayor who refused to endorse him.

And he doesn't even have the guts to appear in public today.

Stick a fork in him, he's done.
Stu Levitan
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3212
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2003 8:40 pm
Location: Studio B of the historic Abernathy Building

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby kurt_w » Thu Jan 09, 2014 5:59 am

"because"? Stu, that's a bit of jumping to conclusions.

Yes, a bunch of EMS responders were delayed because of the traffic snarls, in some cases taking twice as much time as normal to reach the scene.

And yes, an elderly woman died. But she apparently died (of cardiac arrest) at the hospital, and given her age there's no way to know whether she would have survived if it had taken the paramedics three minutes to arrive on-scene rather than seven. It's certainly possible that Christie's staff caused her death, but it's not clear enough to say A happened "because" of B.

Or so it seems to me.... YMMV.

However, the people who inflicted those traffic snarls on Fort Lee certainly are guilty of reckless endangerment. Whether or not the old woman's death is directly attributable to the delay, there's no excuse for this.

And you're right, it does seem to be reaching very close to Christie himself now. It will be interesting to see if any further testimony comes out today.
kurt_w
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 4971
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2003 3:11 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby wack wack » Thu Jan 09, 2014 9:25 am

Has anyone seen a "false flag" report on this yet? We all know it's coming.
wack wack
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3082
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2003 5:32 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby rabble » Thu Jan 09, 2014 9:35 am

kurt_w wrote:However, the people who inflicted those traffic snarls on Fort Lee certainly are guilty of reckless endangerment. Whether or not the old woman's death is directly attributable to the delay, there's no excuse for this.

And you're right, it does seem to be reaching very close to Christie himself now. It will be interesting to see if any further testimony comes out today.

I can't see how any further testimony would help Christie. At best he's guilty of hand picking high level staff who have no qualms about endangering innocent lives in a political retaliation. At worst, the people who say nothing goes on in his office that he doesn't know about might be correct.

He's also guilty of hiring staff who think they're so untouchable they can use email to break the law and not worry one whit about anything incriminating.

There has to be at least one law broken here. They interfered with emergency response teams for retaliatory purposes and then lied to investigators about the reason.
rabble
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 6010
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:50 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby snoqueen » Thu Jan 09, 2014 11:23 am

rabble wrote:
He's also guilty of hiring staff who think they're so untouchable they can use email to break the law and not worry one whit about anything incriminating.


Straight out of the Scott Walker playbook, interestingly.


They interfered with emergency response teams for retaliatory purposes and then lied to investigators about the reason.


That's a true and realistic statement. I object to Levitan's phrasing in this topic's subject line, which is a mirror image of what Lawrence Meade did on the forum for way too long. Innuendo, deniability, "hey, show me where I said it...."

Cut that stuff out. It does your cause no good to roll in the dirt just because other people do it.
snoqueen
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 11312
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 11:42 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby narcoleptish » Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:22 pm

All kinds of things are done on purpose that snarl traffic to the point of hindering emergency response. Ironman, parades, Badger football traffic, etc. The last time the president visited, half the city was gridlocked in the middle of rush hour.

Not condoning what Christie did, but hanging a death on him is political operative effluent of the worst kind.
narcoleptish
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3615
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2005 1:35 am

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby fisticuffs » Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:28 pm

I thought this was a pretty good read:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... esign.html
but no way I see him resigning. No way I see this affecting his chances in the GOP. I mean they have already turned on this guy once and come back after he got Obama cooties on him. They really won't care.
fisticuffs
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 7785
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 2:49 pm
Location: Slightly outside of Madison

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Ned Flanders » Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:37 pm

Hey. Wat you lokkin at? Dat's how we get tings done in Joisey. Fugetaboutit.
Image
Ned Flanders
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 13247
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2001 2:48 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Stu Levitan » Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:26 pm

Wow, Ned, that's really funny!

An administration uses its raw power to hurt tens of thousands of innocent people whose only mistake was being in the town whose mayor didn't support the governor's re-election, and you make a Jersey-is-all-mobbed-up joke. Snap!

BTW - mayor's childhood friend took the fifth today. And I know how much you respect people under investigation doing that, right?
Stu Levitan
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3212
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2003 8:40 pm
Location: Studio B of the historic Abernathy Building

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:49 pm

narcoleptish wrote:All kinds of things are done on purpose that snarl traffic to the point of hindering emergency response. Ironman, parades, Badger football traffic, etc. The last time the president visited, half the city was gridlocked in the middle of rush hour.

None of those examples involve criminal intent.
Henry Vilas
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 19600
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Name sez it all

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Stebben84 » Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:55 pm

From Christie's press conference transcript:

If there is any information that you know about the decision to close these lanes in Fort Lee, you have one hour to tell either my chief of staff, Kevin O'Dowd, or my chief counsel, Charlie McKenna.

And I told them that in an hour I was going to go out in a press conference. And if no one gave me other information to the contrary that I was going to say that no one on my staff was involved in this matter.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/ ... story.html

So in other words, if I don't hear anything from you in an hour, cough, cough, then we're all good, right? Right?
Stebben84
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 4760
Joined: Thu Mar 02, 2006 12:59 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby rabble » Thu Jan 09, 2014 2:04 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:
narcoleptish wrote:All kinds of things are done on purpose that snarl traffic to the point of hindering emergency response. Ironman, parades, Badger football traffic, etc. The last time the president visited, half the city was gridlocked in the middle of rush hour.

None of those examples involve criminal intent.

And I'm pretty sure all of the above tell the emergency responders what's about to happen and they do it very far in advance.

The Christie crew knew EMTs and ambulances would be using the bridge because no notice was given and they didn't give a fuck. That's cold.
rabble
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 6010
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:50 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Donald » Thu Jan 09, 2014 3:31 pm

I'm not so concerned about Christie lying after the fact. I pretty much expect that. The abuse of power is also something I expect from people with Christie's personality. It's pretty much in character, and, unfortunately, a lot of people, especially on the right, like that sort of "leadership."

It doesn't matter to me if Christie gave the final go-ahead. These sorts of things are set up ahead of time, with plausible deniability scenarios for the big enchiladas. There is always an escape if the abuse of power is discovered--firing someone who is supposedly at fault is the usual practice.

It's obvious from the email exchange that some pre-planning for traffic dirty tricks had been secretly discussed. It wouldn't surprise me if there are other similar events that come to light. Traffic snarls and delayed funding are a great way to get back at local officials who give you trouble.

None of these dirty tricks need to be spelled out in detail in an email. It becomes normal operating procedure. The big enchilada just provides enough leeway to a few of his trusted staff to do these sorts of things.
Donald
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 2304
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2002 4:53 pm
Location: Madison

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Ned Flanders » Thu Jan 09, 2014 5:32 pm

Like I said, it's how they roll in Jersey, arguably the epicenter of Democrat dirty trix...
'
But that story, relayed hours after Gov. Jon S. Corzine was critically injured, has been debunked by a new state police report detailing how his driver was dashing with emergency lights flashing at 91 mph in a 65 mph zone. The alleged erratic driver wasn't a villain but a young man trying to get out of the way of the governor's onrushing SUV"..

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nat ... rash_N.htm
Ned Flanders
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 13247
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2001 2:48 pm

Re: Christie lied, a woman died

Postby Stebben84 » Thu Jan 09, 2014 5:39 pm

This pretty much sums up our political system.

Voters Shocked Christie Botched Such An Easy Political Cover-Up

At press time, many Americans reported their faith in Christie’s presidential qualifications was somewhat restored after he released a series of statements pinning the blame on others and throwing top aides under the bus.
Stebben84
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 4760
Joined: Thu Mar 02, 2006 12:59 pm

Next

Return to National Politics & Government

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Donald and 3 guests

moviesmusiceats
Select a Movie
Select a Theater


commentsViewedForum
  ISTHMUS FLICKR

Promotions Contact us Privacy Policy Jobs Newsletters RSS
Collapse Photo Bar